Camp Pendleton jeep

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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by Marine EOD » Tue Aug 24, 2021 7:56 am

Hi,

If I could jump in, perhaps I could add to the confusion...

I was stationed at Camp Pendleton for most of my 31-plus years in the Corps. Was an Infantryman in 1st MARDIV, and an EOD tech with the MLG/FSSG, and the Marine Air Wing there.

Also ran an EOD shop for MCBCAMPEN under the Base HQ Battalion, so I got the chance to get to know the good folks over at the Mechanized Museum and within the Base Historical Society.

It was my observation that the Camp Pendleton "brand" marking was only used on vehicles which were assigned for the permanent use of the Base. The "brand" was never applied to vehicles from Division, MAW or MLG/FSSG. The brand is still used to this day, although only on vehicles belonging to the infrastructure of the permanent Marine Corps Base. I believe that vehicles belonging to H&S Battalion (which falls under MCB Camp Pendleton) used to use the "brand", but they had stopped using it by the time I was assigned there as an EOD officer.

From what i understand, the brand was originally the cattle brand for the O'Neill family who originally owned and ran cattle on what eventually became Camp Pendleton, before it was sold to the Marines just before WWII. I was informed that the Base had been using this brand symbol as an homage to the original origin/family since the beginning when the Marines took control of the land and began building out the Base.

I hope my recollections helped, and did not muddy the water.

As a side note, back in the late 80s and early 1990s, there were many old M151 jeeps being used by civilian Base personnel there for various duties. I recall seeing several being used down by the beaches at San Onefre and they had been painted in various colors. Some red, some yellow, some still camouflaged, and yes, some painted gray. Some even had mixed colors! This did not denote transfer from the Navy to the Corps. It had to do with what color paint was available at the facility maintaining these for Base use at the time, and old paint that the facility wanted to use up rather than dispose of. These were no longer vehicles going to war with strict painting guidelines. They were vehicles on thier last legs, using leftover parts to clear them from the supply system, and were going to be used by civilians for utility duties aboard the Base. The USMC has ALWAYS been tight for money, and using old M151s and maintaining then on a budget falls right in line with some of the weird colors and stuff that we see under paint. Not all of the time, but enough to be aware of the possibilities on older vehicles like GPWs and MBs.

Just my 2 cents based on observations and talking to folks while I was there. Hope I don't tee-off anyone.

Semper Fi,

Bryan.


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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by Frank USMC » Thu Aug 26, 2021 4:58 pm

Bryan
My daughter volunteers at the museum there, she is in the navy, and her name is Jamie Brewer.
On the the Marines getting there money out of equipment, here at MCAS Cherry Point, we use the WWll Navy Mark ll bomb trailers as cargo wagons to move parts around. They did have one with a water pump mounted on it at one time to drain ditches.
One of the few, Frank USMC RET

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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by gpwmke » Fri Aug 27, 2021 6:37 pm

Hey Frank, Do theyever surplus out those mark 2 trailers? I would like to have one to tow behind my ww2 Navy jeep.

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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by Marine EOD » Sat Aug 28, 2021 2:00 pm

Yeah Frank,

Not surprised in the least. As you are likely aware, before the GWOT kicked off, the Corps was running on a pretty slim budget. There was a lot of stuff still being used in various areas. I never ceased to be surprised.

An example being the old M151 jeeps being utilized well into the mid 1990s back when I was a Grunt in 3/1. Heavily modified with very large wheels and roll bars over the windshield area, these were found to be excellent for use with our heavy machine gun sections (M2 .50 MG and Mk 19 GL) and so mounted for use with the old CH53 helos. A HMMWV would not fit, but the old M151s worked fine for use as gun platforms for airfield seizure missions and the like.

Found the remains of many older military vehicles and tanks and whatnot deep in the impact areas that had been used as targets. Even found an old mighty mite USMC jeep on a machine gun range that had rolled down into a wash years before with nary a bullet hole on it. The thing was faded but looked pretty much like a good candidate for a restoration. Too bad we had to leave it on the impact area...

I will look your daughter up the next time I go over there. Supposed to link up with one of the museum docents next week, so who knows? One of my retirement homes is here in Oceanside so I'm local for a good portion of each year.

On a side note, I bought a 42 Ford GPW right after I retired, so I could do a restoration on it. The Main reason I joined the G503. You may see more posts from me in the future as I tear this thing apart.

S/F

Bryan.

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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by Michel » Tue Sep 21, 2021 12:26 pm

Marine EOD wrote:
Tue Aug 24, 2021 7:56 am
Hi,

If I could jump in, perhaps I could add to the confusion...

I was stationed at Camp Pendleton for most of my 31-plus years in the Corps. Was an Infantryman in 1st MARDIV, and an EOD tech with the MLG/FSSG, and the Marine Air Wing there.

Also ran an EOD shop for MCBCAMPEN under the Base HQ Battalion, so I got the chance to get to know the good folks over at the Mechanized Museum and within the Base Historical Society.

It was my observation that the Camp Pendleton "brand" marking was only used on vehicles which were assigned for the permanent use of the Base. The "brand" was never applied to vehicles from Division, MAW or MLG/FSSG. The brand is still used to this day, although only on vehicles belonging to the infrastructure of the permanent Marine Corps Base. I believe that vehicles belonging to H&S Battalion (which falls under MCB Camp Pendleton) used to use the "brand", but they had stopped using it by the time I was assigned there as an EOD officer.

From what i understand, the brand was originally the cattle brand for the O'Neill family who originally owned and ran cattle on what eventually became Camp Pendleton, before it was sold to the Marines just before WWII. I was informed that the Base had been using this brand symbol as an homage to the original origin/family since the beginning when the Marines took control of the land and began building out the Base.

I hope my recollections helped, and did not muddy the water.

As a side note, back in the late 80s and early 1990s, there were many old M151 jeeps being used by civilian Base personnel there for various duties. I recall seeing several being used down by the beaches at San Onefre and they had been painted in various colors. Some red, some yellow, some still camouflaged, and yes, some painted gray. Some even had mixed colors! This did not denote transfer from the Navy to the Corps. It had to do with what color paint was available at the facility maintaining these for Base use at the time, and old paint that the facility wanted to use up rather than dispose of. These were no longer vehicles going to war with strict painting guidelines. They were vehicles on thier last legs, using leftover parts to clear them from the supply system, and were going to be used by civilians for utility duties aboard the Base. The USMC has ALWAYS been tight for money, and using old M151s and maintaining then on a budget falls right in line with some of the weird colors and stuff that we see under paint. Not all of the time, but enough to be aware of the possibilities on older vehicles like GPWs and MBs.

Just my 2 cents based on observations and talking to folks while I was there. Hope I don't tee-off anyone.

Semper Fi,

Bryan.
Hi Bryan¸
Thank you for your response very helpful. Indeed, I think my jeep is only used permanently on the base. I'm just sorry I can't figure out what the letters "BD" or maybe even "BB" on the back mean.
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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by Michel » Sat Jan 22, 2022 8:33 am

Hello all,
A small update and question; visited the restorer of my jeep frame today. He found an extra number on the driver side frame horn. There are 5 numbers to see, namely; 23448. Anyone ever seen this or know what it could mean? We can't figure it out. I was thinking maybe the USMC number? But most I've seen start with a 3 or a 5. Thanks in advance.
C96C1482-6A84-4EFD-91CD-B366C8C07975.jpeg
Last edited by Michel on Sat Jan 22, 2022 2:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by The Fireman » Sat Jan 22, 2022 9:50 am

Michel,

For what it is worth. The May of 43 GPW matching numbers jeep I restored, had a USMC registration number of 79576. It now resides at the National Museum of the Marine Corps, Triangle (Quantico), Virginia. If you do a search on the jeep at the museum, there will be a short video narrated by one of the staff at the Museum. The story of the restoration was featured in MVPA Army Motors issue 127. This jeep was attached to B company, Fifth Medical Battalion, 27 Marines, 5 th Marine Division when on Iwo Jima.

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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by Michel » Sat Jan 22, 2022 12:35 pm

Thanks for your comment. How wonderful that you have restored a jeep that served on Iwo Jima and that this piece of history is now preserved in the USMC museum. I'm going to check it out.
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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by pgcf » Sun Jan 23, 2022 4:29 pm

Michel,

I have been watching this thread with great interest for a while. I do not think you are going to find the specifics you are looking for but there are facts and clues that you can use for your jeep.

As a former Marine officer that served at Camp Pendleton in the 80's and having just finished restoring a 1942 Marine Contract MB, I have spent a lot of time sorting out details and hypotheticals in my restoration that may help you.

I have seen no mention of a data plate or frame tag so I am taking your word that it is a 1944 MB. If the document you provided in your earlier post is actually your jeep's surplus information that is very cool. The "Pendleton Brand" was probably painted over as part of the surplus process. Stockton is over 400 miles north of Camp Pendleton and east of San Francisco so it was definitely a Navy location.

Let's start with what we know:
1. Your jeep was assigned to Camp Pendleton
2. It was built as a standard Army jeep and transferred to the Marines (OD under Forest Green paint)
3. A late war transfer will have a 6 digit yellow number on the hood, you can find pictures of these to get a range

Here are the guesses:
1. The "Pendleton Brand" makes it most likely this jeep was assigned to a Base or "Main Side" unit and not a combat unit with a UNIS marking
2. The stamped number you found on the frame is probably related to a post war sale disposition process
3. Since the BD is painted over the "Brand" this makes me think it is some kind of disposal designation

Recommendations:
1. See if can find any traces of the number (USA and USMC on the hood) this is where both would be painted
2. Paint your jeep OD and then overpaint the outside with Forest Green and put the "Pendleton Brand" on it with 6 digit USMC number
3. Don't obsess about the "BD" unless you learn exactly what it means
4. Enjoy your jeep

Good Luck and I hope this helps.
Peter

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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by Michel » Wed Jan 26, 2022 12:41 pm

Hello Peter,

Thanks for your response very helpful. I am now also convinced that the jeep has probably only been on the base. I emailed The Marine Corps Mechanized Museum and The National Museum of the Marine Corps for help with the lettering on the back but to no avail. I also sent a letter to the previous owner, but unfortunately he was already deceased. So I gave up the active search. Maybe someday I'll find out.
I am currently still busy with the restoration. It's not that fast due to lack of time. I will post some pictures below. The jeep does have a frame number but no data plates. The tub (ACM2) and the frame do belong together and also match the document I found. It has an American Title.

I have already thought that I will first spray the jeep OD and then Forrest green. Then I put the Camp Pendleton logos and the USMC numbers on the hood in yellow. Unfortunately, there was nothing left of the original Hood Numbers because one of the previous owners had already thoroughly sanded and filled the jeep. I'm just thinking about a good estimate for the USMC number. From what I can see from the lists on the forum, there is no real logic in it. So far I've come up with 101080 or 115506 but I'm not quite there yet.

Finally I'm looking for someone who can help me with some Camp Pendleton items to spice up the jeep later. E.g. an old MCB window sticker or something like that.

Regards Michel
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Last edited by Michel on Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by Michel » Wed Jan 26, 2022 12:46 pm

And some more photos.
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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by pgcf » Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:52 pm

Send Javier a PM, I think he reproduced the WWII decals that the Base Vehicles used at Camp Pendleton.

His G name is 2/14Marine

Your jeep will not have any of the Marine Contract additions like the tie-down rings, frame hooks, or Dyneto wiper.

Good Luck,
Peter

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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by Frank USMC » Fri Jan 28, 2022 3:20 pm

On jeeps in the Marine Corps, I am speaking for Camp Lejeune NC, but I am sure Camp Pendleton went though the same thing. When WW2 ended their were hundreds of small army bases up and down both coast, as they closed down, all the vehicles were turned into the nearest big base that was staying open. This would have been hundreds of vehicles. On Camp Lejeune, every other street was blocked off and made into parking areas for all the vehicles coming in from the closing down bases. Talking to one Marine who had just returned from the war, he said they would go up and down the streets, jeeps that were very low mileage and were perfect were tagged to go to the Marines to replace worn out jeeps they had. Jeeps that were not prefect were sent to DRMO. I have several photos he gave me he took during his 30 years in the Marines, in one of the pictures is a jeep I am sure his unit got from the army as it is a Ford GPW jeep with no Marine tow hooks on it.
Think about it hundreds of nice low mileage jeeps, I am sure the units, and the Base got as many as they could.
One of the few, Frank USMC RET

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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by Michel » Tue Feb 01, 2022 10:54 am

Hi Frank,

Thanks for this nice contribution. Adds another piece to the puzzle of surplus jeeps and the provenance of some other USMC and Navy jeeps as they were used again after the war. I myself would love to see these low mileage jeeps.

Michel
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1944 MB 343496 USMC under restoration

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Re: Camp Pendleton jeep

Post by pgcf » Tue Feb 01, 2022 3:58 pm

Michel,

The way the Marines assigned numbers is in blocks. What this means is if they got 1000 jeeps and 500 trailers transferred to them they would give a block of numbers to each. They may get 200 M-2-4's at the same time so they might give 100,000 to 100,100 to the jeeps; 100,101 to 100,301 to the M-2-4's; and then the next 500 to the trailers. It makes perfect sense if you were in the Marines...HA!

I think the best way to get a number is to look at 5th Marine Division pictures in the US and on Iwo Jima. Iwo Jima was their only campaign.

Don't use a number from an ambulance or an MZ radio jeep, they are in their own blocks.

The Division was formed on 11 Nov. 1943 and activated in late Jan 44 at Camp Pendleton. They would start transferring equipment and filling out the equipment related to their Table of Organization in Jan/Feb 44.

Back to my original point, The jeeps would be received in blocks and assigned a number and then sent to a unit. All this would happen on "Main Side" and vehicles that stayed on "Main Side" became Base vehicles.

One final note, the 5th Division returned to Camp Pendleton after Iwo Jima to refit and prepare for the invasion of Japan. Since you don't have any proof that it was only a Base jeep it could easily have been with 5th Division and then transferred to the Base when the war ended or the Division was deactivated in Dec '46. All this is a real possibility and it is your jeep and your story to tell what your restoration is representing.

Hope this helps.
Peter


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