M20 Serial Number 2806-C, what's it tell us?

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82ndrecontbp
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Re: M20 Serial Number 2806-C, what's it tell us?

Post by 82ndrecontbp » Sat Mar 21, 2020 8:53 pm

[attachment=0]middle glacis front small.jpg[/attachment]
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middle glacis front small.jpg

82ndrecontbp
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Re: M20 Serial Number 2806-C, what's it tell us?

Post by 82ndrecontbp » Mon Mar 23, 2020 4:22 pm

[quote="Big D" post_id=1829273 time=1584765790 user_id=17215]
Hello 82ndrecontbp

I’d say 8333-C is the US Ordnance Number but the experts on here will confirm. Do you have some photos?
[/quote]

Do the pics help? Still puzzled as to which number tells me production date and which tells me where it was made. And do ALL of them have 3 numbers on lower right?

Thanks!
Tom

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Re: M20 Serial Number 2806-C, what's it tell us?

Post by Big D » Tue Mar 24, 2020 2:10 am

Hi Tom,

Most of my knowledge is based on what I have learnt here and gleaned from others, so hopefully the resident experts will correct me if I am wrong.

8333-C is the US Ordnance number and is located on both bottom corners of the hull. The 'C' designation means it was made at the Ford plant in Chicago. The Ordnance number on my M8 is 7373 with no 'C', which indicates it was manufactured at the Ford plant in St Paul, Minnesota.

I think the other numbers you have there are panel drawing numbers, but I can't recall seeing any other M8's with those numbers stamped so close to the Ordnance Number.

Using the formula as stated in this thread:

"M8's with serial number 6908 through 9367. “Key” number "6032903" plus US Ordnance Serial Number equals original USA Registration Number."

That would mean the US Registration Number of your M8 would be 6041236.

As far as manufacturing date goes, Joe, Jim, Claude, Tom et al would be best to advise but I'd be guessing late 1944.

Is there a number stamped in the middle of the glacis under the hatch locking channel, or original markings anywhere?
Darryl Lennane
NZ

1943 Willys MB
1941 LP2A MG Carrier
1943 White M3A1 AOP
1942 Willys MBT
1944 Ford M8 Armoured Car

82ndrecontbp
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Re: M20 Serial Number 2806-C, what's it tell us?

Post by 82ndrecontbp » Tue Mar 24, 2020 7:26 am

Thanks Darryl,

I posted a pic of the number in center of front glacis between the two hatches above the ricochet channel.
its number is [b]1397[/b]

I understood the numbering convention, but not which of the numbers to use (especially since I have three in one place).
How certain are you that 8333-C is the right number to use?

I'd be very interested in the date of manufacture!

Thanks for the help guys! Love this forum.

Joe DeMarco
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Re: M20 Serial Number 2806-C, what's it tell us?

Post by Joe DeMarco » Tue Mar 24, 2020 7:52 am

Hi Tom & Darryl,

>I think the other numbers you have there are panel drawing numbers, but I can't recall seeing any other M8's with those numbers stamped so close to the Ordnance Number.

A fellow who has M20 SN 1609 posted a photo where his numbers are stamped close together like that.
His has...

C6068
C119396
1609-C

I would interpolate that the number you share, C119396, is the Ord. Part Number of the glacis plate piece.
Would guess this would be stamped somewhere on the glacis plate of every M8 or M20.
The other number that you don't share is probably the serial number of the individual piece.
I believe Ford made its own armor plate, so that is probably their SN.
You might see a little "F" and an Ordnance Bomb stamped in there somewhere as well.

If there is not too much paint, you will probably see such Part Numbers and SNs on just about every piece that goes to make up your M8.

We haven't been able to collect enough data, but I believe 1397 is a rough build sequence number.
That is, that would have been about the 1397th M8 made at the Ford Chicago plant.
FWIW, they would have produced their 1397th unit in May, 1944.

In addition, 1397 may have been the Manufacturer's Serial Number stamped in the box below the Ord SN on the original dataplate?
Unfortunately, surviving examples with intact original dataplates are rare as hen's teeth.

Not sure, but I don't think that the few folks with St Paul M8s have ever reported finding the "other number" ?

What is odd is that St. Paul made far more M8s than Chicago, but the vast majority of the surviving M8s reported on G503 were made at the Chicago plant.

>The Ordnance number on my M8 is 7373 with no 'C', which indicates it was manufactured at the Ford plant in St Paul, Minnesota.

I believe another St. Paul clue is that the Serial Number is stamped 2 or 3 inches higher up on the glacis, whereas the Chicagos are stamped right on the edge.

Stay well, gents.

Joe

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Re: M20 Serial Number 2806-C, what's it tell us?

Post by blackcat77 » Thu Mar 26, 2020 2:14 pm

Big D wrote:
Tue Mar 24, 2020 2:10 am
Hi Tom,

Most of my knowledge is based on what I have learnt here and gleaned from others, so hopefully the resident experts will correct me if I am wrong.

8333-C is the US Ordnance number and is located on both bottom corners of the hull. The 'C' designation means it was made at the Ford plant in Chicago. The Ordnance number on my M8 is 7373 with no 'C', which indicates it was manufactured at the Ford plant in St Paul, Minnesota.

I think the other numbers you have there are panel drawing numbers, but I can't recall seeing any other M8's with those numbers stamped so close to the Ordnance Number.

Using the formula as stated in this thread:

"M8's with serial number 6908 through 9367. “Key” number "6032903" plus US Ordnance Serial Number equals original USA Registration Number."

That would mean the US Registration Number of your M8 would be 6041236.

As far as manufacturing date goes, Joe, Jim, Claude, Tom et al would be best to advise but I'd be guessing late 1944.

Is there a number stamped in the middle of the glacis under the hatch locking channel, or original markings anywhere?

Hello Darryl;
Iagree with your analysis, there is the 8325 in the book on the ARMORED CAR LIGHT of R.P. HUNNICUTT page 118 to 123, its rn: 6041228, that corresponds perfectly for my.
I know the back part of your hull 7373 in France.
Regards;
Serge

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Re: M20 Serial Number 2806-C, what's it tell us?

Post by Big D » Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:49 pm

Hello Serge,

Thanks, but I can't take any credit. The work was already done by the experts on this thread.

That's very interesting about your M8. I haven't seen that book. Are you able to post that picture here along with a picture of your M8? Do you have the original data plate on your M8?

So you recall seeing my M8 hull in France? It is well travelled!
Darryl Lennane
NZ

1943 Willys MB
1941 LP2A MG Carrier
1943 White M3A1 AOP
1942 Willys MBT
1944 Ford M8 Armoured Car

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Re: M20 Serial Number 2806-C, what's it tell us?

Post by blackcat77 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 3:12 am

Hello;
I fully understand your judgment, there are no worries :wink:
I am a French collector and i have only owned the M8 for 30 years, the 6502 and 5798.
I remember seeing in 2015 your M8 in parts on a trailer to Clermont-Ferrand during a meeting.
The rear part 7373 that i know is in the north of France.
Sorry, i can't post a photo on the forum.
Regards;
Serge

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Re: M20 Serial Number 2806-C, what's it tell us?

Post by blackcat77 » Fri Mar 27, 2020 5:28 am

Re;
On the post of your restoration, the first page at the meeting of CHARTRES in 2015mine is on the 5th photo, the 4-X 4R-4 from the back, my brother drives that of Mr DOURS wich follows.
Regards;
Serge

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Re: M20 Serial Number 2806-C, what's it tell us?

Post by Big D » Fri Mar 27, 2020 11:21 pm

Hello Serge

Nice M8! Do you have original data plates in yours? Would you like me to message you and I can help with uploading the photos you have?

I wish I’d known about the hull 5 years ago!
Darryl Lennane
NZ

1943 Willys MB
1941 LP2A MG Carrier
1943 White M3A1 AOP
1942 Willys MBT
1944 Ford M8 Armoured Car

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