SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

1985 - Present, Questions, discussions, regarding anything related to the Humvee. (NO AUCTION or EBAY)

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SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

Post by B8B » Mon Jul 26, 2021 7:05 pm

An unusual request: I'm looking to find SMALLER wheels and tires that would properly fit on an HMMWV trailer hub.

I have a LTT-HC trailer chassis (from which the M1102 HMMWV trailer is built) with a flat bed that I'd like to use as a 'Mule hauler' for my Willys/Kaiser M274A3:
LTT-HC As Purchased sm.jpg
LTT-HC Flatbed Trailer
Since it sits on stock HMMWV 12-bolt wheels and 20+ year old Goodyear Wrangler MT tires, it's taller than I'd like, and since I'll be doing very limited off-roading with it, I'd like to see what wheel/tire combos would lower the height and weight (and the price!) of the tires. Plain steel wheels with somewhat military-looking tires (like 7x16 NDTs?) would be fine, and the total weight of the trailer/load combo would be less than 2500 lbs.

I just taught myself today (with a helpful Tire Rack guy's help) about light truck wheel and tire sizing and terminology. To stay on the same page, what are the official dimensions (that I'd ask of a wheel dealer) of a 12-bolt HMMWV wheel? The Tire Rack guy said that for a HUMMER H1, they are:
Diameter: 16.5"
Width: 8.3" wide (at the beads - I've see 8.25" elsewhere)
Offset: +50mm (I've seen 55mm elsewhere)
Center Bore: 117mm

The closest vehicle match we could come up to start asking about (at used wheel/tire dealers) that had an 8x6.5 lug pattern and a rather large hub center bore were an '81 Ford F250 and an '82 Chevy K20. Backspace/offset sound like they're important, because I'd like to end up with the tires still fitting within the fenders.

Is my 'quest' feasible and recommendable? If so, any suggestions on smaller and cheaper stock wheels and tires that would fit and work properly on the trailer and lower it by at least a couple of inches? Should I find some that work, I'll put my stock HMMWV set for sale.

Thanks in advance!
'58 M274A3 Mule, SN 10965
'62 M422A1 Mighty-Mite, SN 3741
'65 M416-B1 Mighty-Mite Trailer, SN 11
'97 LTT-HC 'Mule Hauler' Trailer, SN "H.A.C.-054"


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Re: SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

Post by Action » Mon Jul 26, 2021 7:37 pm

8 x 6.5

dodge ram
hummer h2
Wheels for the 8x6.5" bolt pattern is one of the most common 8 lug truck fitments in the wheel world today. The 8x6.5" bolt pattern has been used on the Dodge Ram 2500 & 3500 dating back to 1946, Ford F250 & F350 trucks from 1955 to 1998, and also the Chevy & GMC 2500 & 3500 trucks from 1967 to 2011.
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Re: SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

Post by dilvoy » Mon Jul 26, 2021 9:25 pm

I believe that the hub needs to be bored larger on the H2 wheels for them to fit onto the Humvee. I don't think hub centricity is too important on that trailer so you might look for hub holes that are larger than needed. Might come up with an easily available wheel that way. The humvee wheels are wide compared to normal truck wheels and modern trucks have a good offset on 4x4's to match up with the fenders on that trailer. Forgetting about the 16.5 tire size is good too as those are really hard to find these days. 16" and 17" wheels and tires are way easier to find these days,
George D. Paxinos

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M1123A2

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Re: SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

Post by Action » Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:58 am

Look for the above trucks at a junkyard. You may find good spares still under the beds. Maybe plain black rims, too

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Re: SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

Post by Kurt Lesser » Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:01 am

I have a set of M880, 8 lug wheels on one of mine that work well. You might find that standard Chevy Blazer wheels will also work but I believe the wheel offset is slightly different.
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US Navy, 1969-1975
M996A1 Ambulance w/M101A3 Trailer
M274A2 Mule
M151A1 Mutt w/M416B1 Trailer
M890 Crew cab

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Re: SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

Post by W. Winget » Tue Jul 27, 2021 10:37 am

Dorman $76.99 New.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/RNB- ... gLOffD_BwE

Or Junk Yard and gone in perhaps 45 minutes for a pair of them.

..any trailer store should have an 8 lug rim with tire mounted for between $120 and $200.

If you save the originals, the trailer will be worth what you paid for it in the future to a collector unless it's butchered.
V/R W. Winget
Looking for 1918 Standard B 'Liberty' truck parts

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Re: SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

Post by 86humv » Wed Jul 28, 2021 6:53 pm

Kurt Lesser wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:01 am
I have a set of M880, 8 lug wheels on one of mine that work well. You might find that standard Chevy Blazer wheels will also work but I believe the wheel offset is slightly different.
Blazers are 6 lug
Standard 3/4, and 1 ton are 8 lug.
86 Hmmwv
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Re: SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

Post by Kurt Lesser » Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:14 am

Sorry Greg, I was thinking CUCV,
Kurt Lesser
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M996A1 Ambulance w/M101A3 Trailer
M274A2 Mule
M151A1 Mutt w/M416B1 Trailer
M890 Crew cab

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Re: SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

Post by B8B » Fri Jul 30, 2021 9:34 am

W. Winget wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 10:37 am
Dorman $76.99 New.
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/RNB- ... gLOffD_BwE

Or Junk Yard and gone in perhaps 45 minutes for a pair of them.

..any trailer store should have an 8 lug rim with tire mounted for between $120 and $200.

If you save the originals, the trailer will be worth what you paid for it in the future to a collector unless it's butchered.
V/R W. Winget
Folks,

Some great responses! I actually did an independent search and came up with the exact same wheel from Summit. This leads to more questions:
- If I want it to stay 'military-looking' but with smaller (lower height) tires, I may try putting NDTs on it. I've found some 6x16 wheels and could swap the 6x16 NDTs from my M100 which is for sale at 'Survivor' Original 1952 Strick M100 For Sale' viewtopic.php?f=18&t=324909 . Would my 6x16s handle the weight of a 1200# trailer and a 1000# Mule?
- If that's not recommended, how about the Dorman 7x16 wheels with military 7x16 NDTs - I'd think they have a more appropriate load rating.

Even if these wheel/tire combinations don't lower the bed height much, I'd at lease have a more affordable, easier to find, newer set on the trailer.

I'll also check into the trailer company wheel/tire options.
'58 M274A3 Mule, SN 10965
'62 M422A1 Mighty-Mite, SN 3741
'65 M416-B1 Mighty-Mite Trailer, SN 11
'97 LTT-HC 'Mule Hauler' Trailer, SN "H.A.C.-054"

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Re: SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

Post by B8B » Wed Aug 11, 2021 7:38 pm

A follow-on question -- What are the acceptable wheel widths that a 700x16 Military NDT tire will fit on?

I've learned from the Coker tire site that the specified tire size does NOT necessarily correlate to the wheel width needed to mount them on. In my case, the "Rim Width" spec for their Firestone Military | NDT | 700-16 is 4.50 - 5.50 inches. :(

It's been darned difficult to find appropriate 8x6.5 bolt pattern 16" wheels with such a narrow rim width! The closest I've found would be these:
16x6 8 Lug | 8x6 1/2" bolt | 4.00" backspace | Powder Coat finish Wheels https://www.cokertire.com/wheels/8-lug- ... -16x6.html

So, wheel gurus, would a tire built for a 4.50 - 5.50" Rim Width fit safely on a wheel with a width of 6" width?

It seems like finding the proper wheel/tire combination (other than stock! :P ) is a difficult puzzle.
'58 M274A3 Mule, SN 10965
'62 M422A1 Mighty-Mite, SN 3741
'65 M416-B1 Mighty-Mite Trailer, SN 11
'97 LTT-HC 'Mule Hauler' Trailer, SN "H.A.C.-054"

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Re: SMALLER! Tires and Wheels

Post by W. Winget » Thu Aug 12, 2021 4:41 am

It may have a harder time sealing as a "tubeless" tire, but if you ran with tubes the 1/4" difference per each side would be nill.

I would think to run 7:50 x 16's (from a M151 series) as a better tire than the 7:00 x 16's. they are the same diameter, the NDT holds 340 more Lbs per tire.
Compare 2nd chart down NDTs:
https://www.stausaonline.com/tires/sta-ndcc/

Or if you wanted to keep the HUMVEE tire style look and same size as earlier tire you mentioned:
SUPER TRAXION, SUPERLUG TUBELESS 7.50-16LT E/10ply M&S 18/32 tread 32.20 diameter 6X16 rim 8.70 width 2780 lbs per tire
https://www.stausaonline.com/tires/sta-super-traxion/

I would shop around though, prices vary a lot, and if it's just a trailer, a set of street tires will do fine. (i.e. junkyard rims with tires mounted)
V/R W Winget
Looking for 1918 Standard B 'Liberty' truck parts


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