My quest for more power

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wc56daveyboy
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My quest for more power

Post by wc56daveyboy » Tue Dec 28, 2021 5:14 am

Living at 8700 feet above sea level.

Great running motors in all my trucks. Rebuilt most of them

Altitude plays a very big part in power loss
For instance, my great running motor with
21-22 lbs of vacuum at 1000 feet (where I was living) shows a steady 15 here
A compression reading of 110 is reduced to 85-90 at best.

Not much one can do about the effects of atmospheric pressure BUT I’d like to try… someday..

anyone have a source for a leaner jet(jets) for either the Zenith or Cart ETW1 carb?
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Last edited by wc56daveyboy on Wed Dec 29, 2021 5:23 am, edited 1 time in total.


mdainsd
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Re: My quest for more power

Post by mdainsd » Tue Dec 28, 2021 5:44 pm

Ive thought about this plenty over the years. I would love to try a turbo charger set to a modest boost on some of these engines. Would not take crazy boost to get back to regular power at 8700'.
The Scout Car really needs this. The engine is overbuilt, has 5.6 to 1 compression, 7 main bearings. 320 cubic inches, yet yields like 98 horsepower :cry: . Say 20 pounds of boost and I bet it would be far more manageable out on the road.
52 M38 2X, '52 M37, '44 WC51, '42 WC 56/57, '50 CJ-V35(U), '42 GPW, '44 M3A1 Scout Car, 2010 M-Gator

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Re: My quest for more power

Post by parker007 » Tue Dec 28, 2021 6:01 pm

You can just solder and redrill jets. shaving head may help a little. but i think it wasted road to follow.

wc56daveyboy
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Re: My quest for more power

Post by wc56daveyboy » Wed Dec 29, 2021 4:27 am

shaving head may help a little
Now that I belive could help quite a bit in compression boost
I say this becuse I have a chart (somewhere) of Chrysler engine HP ratings thru the years and if you follow the chart, MY belief is they didn’t do much in design changes to the blocks, but rather the heads were milled /redesigned to get that increase.
but i think it wasted road to follow
your probably right. But a guy can try!!

Hummm.sounds like you been there?
Well I’m thinking the same, maybe not be that big a difference, but sure wouldn’t mind trying
You can just solder and redrill jets
Any recomended drill size to try for this? Not just drill number but drill diameter to start with?
Last edited by wc56daveyboy on Wed Dec 29, 2021 5:22 am, edited 1 time in total.

wc56daveyboy
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Re: My quest for more power

Post by wc56daveyboy » Wed Dec 29, 2021 4:55 am

Here’s one chart I’ve had

https://www.enginefacts.com/dodge230/

this chart starts in 1950 and goes only up to 1959
I can’t find the other chart I had that listed the flathead dodges up to 1968, but that was even more compression and more HP

Notice HP rating in 1950 - 1953
Max Brake Horsepower: 103 @ 3600 rpm
Max Torque: 190 @ 1200 rpm
Stroke: 4.625
Bore: 3.25
Compression: 7.0

Thru the years, up to 1959 (in this chart) the
HP rating increased, along with compression, yet the bore and stroke remained the same.

See 1959 motor spec here;

1959 with 1 Barrel Carb
Max Brake Horsepower: 135 @ 3600 rpm
Max Torque: 205 @ 1200 rpm
Stroke: 4.625
Bore: 3.25
Compression: 8.0

That’s a 32 hp increase with a raised compression
From 7.0 to 8.0
One can only surmise the changes over the years we’re mainly done to the head design

Now this particular chart starts at 1950

I’m
Pretty sure the 1943 dated T-214 motor in my wc57 is a lot less HP prior to 1950

The thing is, we can all get these flatheads to preform better with dual carbs, custom headers, turbos, etc etc.

but we also want them to remain stock looking. This isn’t a hot rod site. We strive for originality. But. One could get the engine HP boosted by a later head or machine work yet still look 100% stock under the hood.

That would be my goal.

However, I may try my
“Testing” all this theory on paper, on my wc12 which has a non original rebuilt 1954 plymouth block with the “diamond” prefix (making it a 230 CI)

I have a nice takeout 1968 dated block with original head sitting in my shop. Purchased this just becuse it was one of the later blocks and eventually try this swap to see.


Just hard to tear down a good running motor at the moment!!

mdainsd
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Re: My quest for more power

Post by mdainsd » Fri Jan 07, 2022 2:45 pm

wc56daveyboy wrote:
Tue Dec 28, 2021 5:14 am
anyone have a source for a leaner jet(jets) for either the Zenith or Cart ETW1 carb?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/294263697443?h ... SwS7hXAXma
52 M38 2X, '52 M37, '44 WC51, '42 WC 56/57, '50 CJ-V35(U), '42 GPW, '44 M3A1 Scout Car, 2010 M-Gator

wc56daveyboy
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Re: My quest for more power

Post by wc56daveyboy » Fri Jan 07, 2022 3:54 pm

Hummm. I think that may be for a Zenith tractor carb?

mdainsd
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Re: My quest for more power

Post by mdainsd » Mon Jan 10, 2022 5:45 pm

Might be, but thought it might be worth a looking at in case they could be used on the other Zenith Carbs.
52 M38 2X, '52 M37, '44 WC51, '42 WC 56/57, '50 CJ-V35(U), '42 GPW, '44 M3A1 Scout Car, 2010 M-Gator

wc56daveyboy
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Re: My quest for more power

Post by wc56daveyboy » Mon Aug 28, 2023 5:09 pm

Dual headers/ dual exhaust?

Anyone done this on their WC 1/2 ton trucks?
I think “DOZERMAN” has done a lot in the power upgrade area

I live at 8500 feet above sea level, and as such, I’ve lost a considerable amount of compression/HP.

I’m working toward some performance “updgrades” if you will.

Last month, I finished the head swap to a later (57-59) higher compression iron head.

While the results are not staggering and I won’t beat any land speed records, I DO feel the increase. I’m now able to climb a long grade in 4th without requiring a down shift to 3rd.

Though I cannot accelerate in 4th, at least I’m able to maintain 30-35 mph up that hill. And not hold back traffic too badly.

Better than what I was dealing with prior I can tell you that! Prior, it would be screaming in third, and once I shift to 4th, bogged down so badly I had no recourse but to return to third and 25mph

So this first change that I’ve been wanting to do for a couple years now, is complete!

I now have my sights on the next step:

installing dual split exhaust headers.

It’s the next so called improvement to increase HP by letting the engine breathe better. Some say it will really wake the engine up with better exhaust

So I bought these headers from
12bolt.com:


https://www.12bolt.com/store/p578/Dual_ ... 6_230.html


These are nice! Cast like the early hot rod Fenton headers.

I’m exploring the best way to route the exhaust, and what mufflers to consider.
With a transfer case in the way, putting two stock mufflers (6”-7” in diameter) side by side woukd not work to well.

Considering the standard hush type glass packs. Only 3” in diameter, and two should fit nicely in the space of the one stock muffler.

Anyone ever do this “upgrade” to talk details with?

What mufflers did you use?
How did you route the pipes?
Where did you exit the tailpipe?

With the fuel tank under the back, there is no option to run pipes all
The way to the rear of the truck

Did you notice any increase with dual exhaust headers and mufflers?

Any experience with this, I’m
All ears to listen to someone who has been there.

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Re: My quest for more power

Post by kelley » Tue Aug 29, 2023 3:30 pm

Hey Dave,
I have no experience doing what you’re trying to do, but…
My M37 (T245) same basic 230 engine, couldn’t get out of its own way and was even worse on hills.
I bought an oversized exhaust (2-1/2”) from M series Rebuild and it made a very noticeable difference. Might be worth taking a look.
https://www.mseriesrebuild.com/buy_sale.html#
Best,
Jon Kelley
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wc56daveyboy
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Re: My quest for more power

Post by wc56daveyboy » Wed Oct 25, 2023 5:17 pm

***UPDATE***

Headers installed. New exhaust system in place.
Had a local muffler shop cut, bend and build a custom exhaust.

My goal was the use the same stock muffler located in the same location, should I ever want to go back to stock.

I ibstalled a brand new, NOS muffler I had squirreled away.
What the heck. Not sure I’ll ever use elsewhere.

The two headers are 3 into one dumps.
The shop built two pipes back to a 2” collector, and dumps into the stock muffler.

Taking the truck up
The same hill today, there was a slight noticeable increase in power.

So the headers made yet another improvement

In 4th, all the way up the same grade. Not lugging nearly as much. In fact, doing well.

I could make the grade easily now in 4th gear.maybe
A slight noticable acceleration now. Very faint if any.

Again, not a hot rod here.
But much better now

So in a nutshell there was a change for the better with the exhaust headers from 12bolt.com.

So far, the higher compression head made a difference. Now the headers and new exhaust added to the power increase

Next up is the Webber 2bbl carb.

Let’s see!

wc56daveyboy
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Re: My quest for more power

Post by wc56daveyboy » Fri Nov 10, 2023 4:49 am

And the final phase is complete.

I added a Weber 32/36 progressive carb on the truck
Very easy swap requiring only minimal linkage adjustments

The truck now seems very responsive.

While at my workshop, I was able to make the long grade dirt road in third with power to accelerate. That’s a big difference. Can’t try 4th here, because it’s too short of a hill and very curvy.

Then I took the truck back home to the town I live in.
Took it up the same road into town
Seems even more “peppy” if that word can even be used in this trucks vocabulary!

But it’s for sure got even more power. I don’t see any difference when the secondary barrel kicks in.

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Re: My quest for more power

Post by rdinatal » Fri Nov 10, 2023 8:12 am

wc56daveyboy wrote:
Fri Nov 10, 2023 4:49 am
And the final phase is complete.

I added a Weber 32/36 progressive carb
Do you have a link, or info, on the intake you used?
1952 M37 - Mods so far = Locking hubs, battery switch, 2 bank charger, PB, PS, Pertronix SSI, Elect fuel pump w/water separator.
Planned:
Bimini top :roll:


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