WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

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Gaston C Barmore
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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by Gaston C Barmore » Wed Nov 14, 2018 8:58 am

Here's a picture of the box on my 1942 WC-56.Image
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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by mdainsd » Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:15 am

I wondered about that area, thought it might be too far forward. But looking at your pics, the wires on the wiring harness could service that location.

Your box looks new, did you add it or was there one there all along?

Thanks!

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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by Gaston C Barmore » Wed Nov 14, 2018 2:03 pm

Box was missing along with the trailer socket. Mounting holes for the box was present.
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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by mdainsd » Wed Nov 14, 2018 2:35 pm

Interesting. Mine never had holes there. i think Im going to leave it off my truck. I'll save it for the WC-52 12Volt in the pasture.

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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by Fred Coldwell » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:04 pm

In reading again closely the description of the resistor box system excerpted earlier today from TM 9-808 C 1, I noticed in section 123 that the "trailer connector on the weapon carrier with the 12 volt system has been modified, and in section 104 by "an added ground terminal on the new connector." In ORD 9 SNL G-502 dated 21 May 1945 section 0617 - Trailer Couplings (Electric) on page 182, there appears a second new trailer connector assembly CC-1089674, one numeral less than its wiring harness CC-1098675. The earlier standard trailer connector assembly CC-926056 is also listed, for the Weapon Carrier, Telephone Maintenance and Installation trucks.

Digging deep into my Dodge treasure chest, I found a trailer connector that has 5 terminals on its rear end, seen here on the right next to a standard trailer connector with the standard 4 terminals on its rear end. Both trailer connectors are oriented the same way as indicated by the drain holes on their bottoms:

trailer socket ends.jpg
trailer socket ends.jpg (120.86 KiB) Viewed 90 times

The trailer socket on the right with the 5 terminal ends should be CC-1089674 that is used with the resistor box. The ground blade inside this 5 terminal trailer socket is divided in half with each side insulated from the other. The reason for this is explained in TB 9-808-7 dated 28 February 1945:

d. The trailer connector has been modified . . . and incorporates another ground terminal, resulting in two separately insulated surfaces of the ground blade. The new connector with the two isolated surfaces on the ground blade may be used on 6 volt trucks, but the former one piece ground blade [CC-926056] cannot be used on 12 volt vehicles.

e. . . . The resistor-to-trailer connector wiring [harness] assembly includes a ground wire that connects the taillight resistance to the added ground terminal on the trailer connector. Thus, the circuit is grounded only when a trailer connector plug is inserted in the trailer connector. The stoplight circuit resistance, however, is grounded to the resistor box, since this circuit is used only when the brakes are applied.


Here are the trailer connectors from the front:

trailer connectors front.jpg
trailer connectors front.jpg (152.38 KiB) Viewed 90 times

The ground blades are both at the 7:00 position, to the left of the bottoms. The blade on the standard 4 terminal connector to the left is solid, but (not too easy to see) the ground blade on the 5 terminal connector to the right is split in half, as indicated by the vertical hairline on its end.

Perhaps part of Zeph's problem is that he installed a standard 4 terminal trailer connector on his WC 1/2-ton 12 volt radio command car instead of the required 5 terminal trailer connector CC-1089674. As noted above, 4 terminal trailer connectors with the one-piece ground blade cannot be used on 12 volt vehicles. So perhaps his search begins for one CC-1089674 trailer connector, which can be identified by my photos above.

Mdainsd, you should check the trailer connector on your 12 volt WC-52 to see if it has 4 terminals or the required 5 terminals. Because Winget will re-bulb his trailer to have 12 volt light bulbs all around, I would not think he would have a problem using the standard 4 terminal trailer socket, but I'm no electrician, so Winget, you're on your own. Enjoy, guys, and socket to your vehicles! :lol:
Happy Jeep Trails,

Fred Coldwell
1944 CJ2-09 - X33
1945 CJ2-26 - X50
1944 Dodge T233 CC
1945 Dodge T233 Utility
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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by mdainsd » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:14 pm

Mine has the five terminal socket, as does my WC-56

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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by MChapin » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:30 pm

Fred- Great information for future projects.

Mark

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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by Fred Coldwell » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:51 pm

mdainsd wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:14 pm
Mine has the five terminal socket, as does my WC-56
You're obviously living right!
MChapin wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:30 pm
Fred- Great information for future projects. Mark
Mark: Great to hear from you! Keep them Dodges rolling down your way. :)
Happy Jeep Trails,

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1944 CJ2-09 - X33
1945 CJ2-26 - X50
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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by W. Winget » Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:22 pm

Rather be digging for manuals than crawling over stuff, third trip out, No holes to mount the box under the spot where Col Barmore's box is located (only a drain hole from appearances)
Socket is four blade (no split in ground tab) and I don't know that it was ever messed with.

Stats: WC 56, # 81573216 date of delivery 42-9-16, I swear I saw a CC one registration number off from mine in a photo in England prepping for invasion, mine was surplused out in Kansas, likely Fort Leavenworth, possibly Ft Riley or one of the airfields that closed down. It looked like undercarriage was overhauled (hubs painted thick Red coat of primer) before being sold off to local Horton, KS. Ford dealer (cut tailgate and upper deck out) that used it as a wrecker, then lost in a card game (Table stakes?) to the local grain elevator owner that used it to push loaded boxcars around :shock: that place swapped ownership leaving her parked till a local farmer bought her for use on his farm and his Sons used it to inspect fences and drive to school. Then she was 'saved' by me for 2K plus $200 more for the 4:30 ratios they had sitting in a parts bus :D Many GO's / FO's, a Governor, Wedding party, other VIPS riding in many parades since her removal from the farm.

I won't be using the box, but we have another CC and a Carryall to build down here, so we'll see if one of them needs it.

Thanks for the info.
V/R W. Winget
Looking for 1918 Standard B 'Liberty' truck parts

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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by Ernie Baals » Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:33 pm

Fred
I use the standard 4 wire trailer socket on the carryall with out any problem?
My benhur has 12 volt bulbs in t for use with the carryall
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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by Fred Coldwell » Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:53 pm

Ernie Baals wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:33 pm
Fred: I use the standard 4 wire trailer socket on the carryall with out any problem? My Ben Hur has 12 volt bulbs in it for use with the carryall.
Hi Ernie:

Thanks for sharing your positive experience when using the same voltage bulbs (12 volts) in your Carryall (with the 4 terminal early trailer connector) and Ben Hur trailer. It indicates Winget should not have any problem using his 4 terminal trailer connector in his 12 volt command car while towing his 12 volt Ben Hur. I think the statement in TB 9-808-7 dated 28 February 1945 that the 4 terminal trailer connector should not be used in 12 volts vehicles applied only when they were towing trailers with 6 volts bulbs, which was standard voltage for trailers throughout WW II.

Using the early 4 terminal trailer connector is not a problem when the bulb voltage in the truck matches the bulb voltage in the trailer, whether 6 volts or 12 volts. The early 4 terminal trailer connector is only a problem when the vehicle voltage is higher than the trailer voltage.
W. Winget wrote:
Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:22 pm
Thanks for the info. V/R W. Winget
You're welcome, Winget. I'm glad you find some of this information useful. Great story on rescuing your command car from Kansas!
Happy Jeep Trails,

Fred Coldwell
1944 CJ2-09 - X33
1945 CJ2-26 - X50
1944 Dodge T233 CC
1945 Dodge T233 Utility
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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by mdainsd » Thu Nov 15, 2018 8:52 am

Well, I hadn't noticed it before, but the 5 terminal socket on the -51 still has the little harness that goes to the box on it. When I first saw it I thought it was just the cut off end of the harness hanging on the socket. But its all there, too tired to use, but a perfect piece to model a new one from.

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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by Fred Coldwell » Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:05 pm

mdainsd:

Congratulations on discovering the CC-1089675 wiring harness from the resistor box to the trailer connector on your 12 volt WC51 (or it is a WC52 as posted earlier?). If a WC51, then it likely came from the factory with its 12 volt electrical system. If a winch-equipped WC52, then it likely was converted to 12 volt sometime during its service life.

In either event, that wring harness provides a correct pattern for making new ones. If you decide to install a resistor box on your WC56 where Gaston C. Barmore installed his, that would be a great time to post in this thread a schematic diagram with measurements of the new CC-10989675 wiring harness you made for that installation. :)

Do you have a copy of TM11-2725, Installation of Radio Equipment in Truck, 3/4-ton, 4x4, Weapon Carrier, dated February 1945? It contains many great radio installations for a 12 volt weapon carrier, as well as a few for a 6 volt weapon carrier, too. That manual was extensively updated by TM11-2725 Changes No. 1 dated 6 July 1945, also a must-have for proper late war radio installations, if that warms your tubes.
Happy Jeep Trails,

Fred Coldwell
1944 CJ2-09 - X33
1945 CJ2-26 - X50
1944 Dodge T233 CC
1945 Dodge T233 Utility
MVPA #283C

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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by mdainsd » Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:31 pm

Fred.

WC-51 winchless. I get my numbers confused sometimes. My CC is currently a 56, but it came with a 57 chassis to boot. Someday.....

I'll have to scrounge up that TM you reference. I like radios although I decided on none for the CC, I like that big open back seat area. And I want to use the map table for a nice glass of wine now and again 8)

My MB project however will be a "follow me" jeep with all the bells and whistles. 12V W7 kit (which ironically does not address the trailer socket), dual rear wheel setup and aircraft radios.

One of my M38s is set up with a full suite of Artillery frequency range radios. I like tubes, er valves :twisted:
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Re: WC-56 Where does the resistor box go?

Post by Fred Coldwell » Fri Nov 16, 2018 2:46 pm

mdainsd:

The radio installation manuals for the WC 3/4 ton weapon carrier are sold by Portrayal Press, $39.00 for for February 1945 TM 11-2725 and $20.00 for its Changes No. 1 dated July 1945. The easiest way to find them is to Google "TM 11-2725" and direct links to Portrayal's two catalog pages for them should appear.

For many years I owned a WC-58 radio command car under restoration and had all the equipment and parts to install an AM/FM radio set: a large SCR-506A am radio set and a small SCR-610 fm radio set. But they would have taken up most of the space in the rear compartment, leaving tight access only from the rear passenger's side. I like your plan to not install any radios in your WC-56 stubby limousine and use the map board for a higher purpose, wine. :D

Your MB "Follow Me" jeep sounds like a great fun project, especially with the aircraft radios in it. MWO ORD G503 W7 dated 25 May 1944 subtly addressed the trailer connector 12 volt issue by instructing in a tiny subparagraph 7(c)(22)(g) to "Disconnect the trailer socket at the socket, and tape the wires", thus rendering it inoperable. Radio jeeps typically were not intended to tow trailers anyway, so there was no practical need to upgrade the trailer connector socket to the later one with the split ground blade from the resistor box.

For many years I owned a MB-Navy Basic 12 volt waterproof radio jeep (project) delivered to the Navy on 10-10-45. It was the precursor to the CJ-V/35U, which was the stopgap until the M38 entered production. But I sold that MB-NB to a friend when I acquired a restored late war waterproof USMC radio jeep that powered a Navy TCS radio set, used primarily for Pacific island forward artillery observation. That USMC radio jeep was sold a few years ago and eventually ended up at Joe's Motor Pool in England. I hope it wasn't destroyed in their recent fire.

Over the decades I've seen only one late war Dodge WC 3/4-ton 12 volt weapon carrier with radios installed, a SCR-608 fm set in a CH-74A chest from foggy memory. I think your 12 volt WC-51 would make an absolutely wonderful display with some late WW II radios installed in it, and encourage you to do so when the time arrives. The above TM-11-2725 manuals are essential to that project, and perusing them in the meantime will really heat up your vacuum valves!

I love very late WW II MVs. Not much is known about them (perhaps because pertinent information about them appears only in post was manuals, which few people bother to collect) and they remain a mostly unexplored area of the MV hobby. Yet even with those post war manuals, many facts about them can only be learned by observation of the vehicles themselves. For example, to relieve stateside casting facilities for other, more important production, some late war T-214 Dodges had a spare tire bracket made of welded flat metal stock rather than being cast. There was another Dodge part welded rather than cast, but it presently escapes my poor memory. This is but one example of why I find very late WW II Dodge trucks so interesting.

Now I'm really jazzed, so here is one more photo of the late war CC-1089674 trailer connector, a real close up of its unusual split and insulated ground blade (now at the top of this photo) clearly showing the two halves and the strip of insulation between them. Enjoy, late war enthusiasts!

split ground blade close up.jpg
split ground blade close up.jpg (243.58 KiB) Viewed 42 times
Happy Jeep Trails,

Fred Coldwell
1944 CJ2-09 - X33
1945 CJ2-26 - X50
1944 Dodge T233 CC
1945 Dodge T233 Utility
MVPA #283C

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