43 GPW with replacement engine

1941 - 1945, Willys MB & Ford GPW jeeps, NO EBAY, Craigslist or COMMERCIAL SALES.
Post Reply
philwarner
G-Private First Class
G-Private First Class
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2022 7:30 am
Location: Northwest Arkansas

43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by philwarner » Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:36 pm

I am considering buying a 1943 GPW with Frame number GPW-114872 and what the seller says is a civilian engine with engine number 4LR105647 and it is titled with that engine number. The seller inherited this GPW from his father and doesn't know much about it, but the frame number does fall in the right range for a 43 GPW. I think from the photos that it has been converted to 12 volts and has a later CJ soft top and a repair sheet on the rear panel. Any idea what is a reasonable price for a GPW that may or may not run (the son says the engine is free but doesn't know if it will run). Any idea what the year and source of this engine might be?

Not sure how to upload images here, but it does look fairly solid with black outside and yellow inside.


Adam
G-Lieutenant General
G-Lieutenant General
Posts: 4526
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2003 6:03 pm
Location: Little Meadows PA

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by Adam » Thu Jan 26, 2023 3:24 am

Does it have a good title? in sellers name? if not does he have inheritance paperwork to prove he owns it. he should change title to his name first. Then again with the engine number on the title, that would need to be changed, here state police need to inspect it or a good service station that will sign paperwork.

have you seen the frame number? verified it is not a patch plate in there

for a decent factory restoration the engine is worthless, 4lr is replacement from the 50's? is this a flat head in there? last 4lr was an overhead valve

What transmission, crawl under and look at underneath of body and frame from various locations, should be no undercoating. what brake is on transfer case. What do brake lines and hoses look like, what wheels and tires are on her What guages and speedo in there. what radiator, carb, battery generator and starter and intake manifold. glove box tags there

top is not correct for a ww2 jeep look close at body,, how much bondo, should be none. what else did bubba change.

pics are nice and usually needed, send them to me if you cant post them and i will post a few.

price guess, I dont want it so not much, maybe for parts here in pa. grand or so sight unseen.

Adam

mosinlover
G-Private First Class
G-Private First Class
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon May 16, 2022 5:06 pm
Location: Tennessee

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by mosinlover » Thu Jan 26, 2023 8:55 am

When is the last time you have seen a rotted tub on a gpw frame for 1,000? Have any you would sell for that?

User avatar
Bill H.
G Moderator
G Moderator
Posts: 6246
Joined: Sun May 31, 1998 8:00 pm
Location: Yonna Valley, Oregon

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by Bill H. » Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:03 am

philwarner wrote:
Wed Jan 25, 2023 7:36 pm
I am considering buying a 1943 GPW with Frame number GPW-114872 and what the seller says is a civilian engine with engine number 4LR105647 and it is titled with that engine number. The seller inherited this GPW from his father and doesn't know much about it, but the frame number does fall in the right range for a 43 GPW. I think from the photos that it has been converted to 12 volts and has a later CJ soft top and a repair sheet on the rear panel. Any idea what is a reasonable price for a GPW that may or may not run (the son says the engine is free but doesn't know if it will run). Any idea what the year and source of this engine might be?

Not sure how to upload images here, but it does look fairly solid with black outside and yellow inside.
Welcome to the site!

FYI, you've posted the same post 3 times now. Give us a chance to approve them. :wink:
Bill H.

"Each shall seek his own kind, in other words, a bird may love a fish but where would they build a home together?" Tevye, Fiddler on the Roof

1952 Dunbar Kapple M100
1953 Willys M38A1
1962 AMC M422A1
1965 Stevens M416B1 X 2
1967 Kaiser M715

2 Timothy 3:1-5

Bruce W
G-Colonel
G-Colonel
Posts: 1684
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2003 4:45 pm
Location: Northeast Colorado

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by Bruce W » Thu Jan 26, 2023 11:08 am

He has also posted the same question in at least two separate threads on the CJ2A page.
BW
G Trp 2nd Sqdrn 3d Armored Cavalry Ft. Lewis 1970-71. 43GPW(Sarge?) 47CJ2A(Teddy) 47CJ2A(Rusty) 47CJ2A(Zak) 48CJ2A(Lefty) 48CJ2A(Uncle Linden) 53CJ3B(Bulldog) 88XJ(Pluto) NE CO

Adam
G-Lieutenant General
G-Lieutenant General
Posts: 4526
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2003 6:03 pm
Location: Little Meadows PA

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by Adam » Sat Jan 28, 2023 3:47 am

Up in the tec forum now.

https://www.thecj2apage.com/forums/engi ... gpw#533788

Until more info and pics of frame and body bottom,i still stand by my info, maybe a little more on the price, but then what does the back of rad look like

Looks like a ww2 carb, decal air filter,,, cant see the back so could be cj, firewall fuel filter, 1 gpw spring

Adam

philwarner
G-Private First Class
G-Private First Class
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2022 7:30 am
Location: Northwest Arkansas

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by philwarner » Tue Jan 31, 2023 8:50 am

Bill H. wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 10:03 am
Welcome to the site!
FYI, you've posted the same post 3 times now. Give us a chance to approve them. :wink:
I apologize for the multiple posts and the first one in the wrong place, Bill. I didn't realize I was on the for sale list when I first posted and then I did not see them come up at the top of the MB GPW Technical Knowledge Base list so thought they were not going through. I tried to send you a private message to ask if I was doing it wrong but the email bounced and I am not getting any posting notices back for some reason. I emailed Ken and he replied that they had been posted and sent me the links and although I still see that the post at the top of the MB GPW Technical Knowledge Base list is one about blackout light wiring dated Jan 20th, I Now I see that newer posts are further down the list including mine. I'll try to be more aware of how the forum works in the future. If there is a way to delete those other posts and keep this one going forward please let me know. Sorry for my confusion.

philwarner
G-Private First Class
G-Private First Class
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2022 7:30 am
Location: Northwest Arkansas

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by philwarner » Tue Jan 31, 2023 9:19 am

Adam wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2023 3:24 am
Does it have a good title? in sellers name? if not does he have inheritance paperwork to prove he owns it. he should change title to his name first. Then again with the engine number on the title, that would need to be changed, here state police need to inspect it or a good service station that will sign paperwork.

have you seen the frame number? verified it is not a patch plate in there

for a decent factory restoration the engine is worthless, 4lr is replacement from the 50's? is this a flat head in there? last 4lr was an overhead valve

What transmission, crawl under and look at underneath of body and frame from various locations, should be no undercoating. what brake is on transfer case. What do brake lines and hoses look like, what wheels and tires are on her What guages and speedo in there. what radiator, carb, battery generator and starter and intake manifold. glove box tags there

top is not correct for a ww2 jeep look close at body,, how much bondo, should be none. what else did bubba change.

pics are nice and usually needed, send them to me if you cant post them and i will post a few.

price guess, I dont want it so not much, maybe for parts here in pa. grand or so sight unseen.

Adam
Adam, I have a partial photo of the title with the current engine number on it; don't know if it is in the son's name or the fathers. The frame number is GPW-114872 from a photo of the frame; no apparent patch plate. Engine appears to be the Go Devil configuration but missing the oil filter. Don't know what transmission or transfer case yet. The son and his friend who listed it do not know much about it. A buddy of mine went to see it and said it looks pretty solid and the photos indicate it is a GPW tub although the windshield may be later CJ2 or 3 with electric wiper motors at the lower edge. Glove box tags are repros with the engine number stamped on a Willys ID tag. It has a tow bar on the front and my buddy thought it was probably assembled as a practical driver. They told him the father had a number of Jeeps and this is the last one. There were also other flat fender Jeep parts on the property under tarps that the son had not known were there. There is a large plate bolted on the back that I first thought might be a fix for someone cutting it out for a tail gate, but have read that failure of the rear panel from the spare tire is common as are patches to the rear body. I will check your contact info and send photos, or will post them here myself if you can tell me how. their asking price is $4750.

I just realized that I am answering this in the for sale section. Can this thread be moved to the technical knowledge base section?

Adam
G-Lieutenant General
G-Lieutenant General
Posts: 4526
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2003 6:03 pm
Location: Little Meadows PA

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by Adam » Tue Jan 31, 2023 10:16 am

Dont worry about all the posts,, moderator will get to them

What do you want to do with it? restore to original or make a driver? $5k you have a driver, if it runs. For me, I do not want a driver, so i would pay at the most what i could part it out for, less maybe 25%. not much ww2 there so far. a cj engine on the floor only goes for a few hundred bucks so a 4lr engine is not a gold mine. If dmv in your state is easy you can change it to its right serial number.


Does your state need a title? does this title need a notary for the signature, a title in the fathers name, that is not signed or notorized if needed is worthless and not legal here. Does the seller really own it? got paperwork from executor? were inheritance taxes paid on it, are there other benefactors or family that want part of the proceeds? bla bla bla. I would want it in the sellers name before i bought it, that can be arranged at time of sale at tag place to make sure it all goes through.

Have fun,, if you want it buy it. put 20K in it to restore it. or a few k and drive it like it is.

ADam

philwarner
G-Private First Class
G-Private First Class
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2022 7:30 am
Location: Northwest Arkansas

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by philwarner » Wed Feb 01, 2023 8:15 am

Adam wrote:
Tue Jan 31, 2023 10:16 am
Dont worry about all the posts,, moderator will get to them

What do you want to do with it? restore to original or make a driver? $5k you have a driver, if it runs. For me, I do not want a driver, so i would pay at the most what i could part it out for, less maybe 25%. not much ww2 there so far. a cj engine on the floor only goes for a few hundred bucks so a 4lr engine is not a gold mine. If dmv in your state is easy you can change it to its right serial number.


Does your state need a title? does this title need a notary for the signature, a title in the fathers name, that is not signed or notorized if needed is worthless and not legal here. Does the seller really own it? got paperwork from executor? were inheritance taxes paid on it, are there other benefactors or family that want part of the proceeds? bla bla bla. I would want it in the sellers name before i bought it, that can be arranged at time of sale at tag place to make sure it all goes through.

Have fun,, if you want it buy it. put 20K in it to restore it. or a few k and drive it like it is.

ADam
Good points about the title, Adam. I would like to return it to a military "look" with a replacement rear panel and perhaps a GPW windshield and expecting to do most of the work myself including paint. I figured $2500 to $3000 for combat wheels and tires and $300 for the rear panel. After that spending $$$ a little at a time for adding accessories like spare carrier and tool straps and another $600 for seat pads. There are other flat fender parts on the property and my buddy said he did see another Jeep windshield but was unaware of what kind at the time. When(if) I make it up there I would hope to negotiate other parts in the deal. His listing also had a set of mudder wheels and tires that I could sell to help finance the other parts. The seller and son are adamant that they know nothing about the condition other than they can turn it over with the fan and it was last tagged in 2003.

Did you get the photos I emailed to you? My internet provider was sold to another company recently and friends report that my email has been flaky ever since and some emails are taking several days. If you have the photos, I'd appreciate it if you could post them here for others to see and comment. I did post some to the CJ-2a forum, but I haven't figured out how photos work here. And given that it appears to be a legitimate GPW frame and tub, is the asking price of $4,750 out of line?

Adam
G-Lieutenant General
G-Lieutenant General
Posts: 4526
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2003 6:03 pm
Location: Little Meadows PA

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by Adam » Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:34 am

2 mails came through,

is the complete engine turning or just the fan? You should to go out there with cash in hand and look it over, If you do not have the time, when will you have the time to make her git up an go? lay on the ground and look underneath, it may be fine and a good deal, or it may be rotted through in places or fishplated together, take a magnet on the body,, is it all bondo? look at the underside of the body. I cant make a good determination of condition of frame or body looks decent from what is really shown of the front frame and springs.

Adam
Attachments
rear%20panel[2].jpg
ID%20tag%20best%20view[1].jpg
309854815_1513179822466638_3181289448848951513_n[1].jpg
308606765_3317907921799208_1712630067739018646_n[1].jpg
306725492_610048107469772_2906377324706854473_n[1].jpg
299100772_1084114118930980_5559688120974265886_n[1].jpg
43%20GPW%20pics%20from%20Mark%20O%20(8)[2].jpg
43%20GPW%20pics%20from%20Mark%20O%20(7)[2].jpg
43%20GPW%20pics%20from%20Mark%20O%20(6)[2].jpg
43%20GPW%20pics%20from%20Mark%20O%20(3)[1].jpg

philwarner
G-Private First Class
G-Private First Class
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2022 7:30 am
Location: Northwest Arkansas

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by philwarner » Wed Feb 01, 2023 2:23 pm

Thanks for posting the photos, Adam,

We're still socked in with ice here and our road is sleeted over and hard, although the mail Jeep did get through today. I think the week end is supposed to be nice so maybe I can get up there them - it is a 6 hour drive but I can stay with my Buddy.

The fellow I've been corresponding with has said several times that it is not locked up so I assumed turning the fan did turn the engine, but it is a fair point to confirm. I asked my buddy about the front floor because the photo looked Iffy, and he said there were old floor mats and some cardboard on the floor but it appeared to be solid.

So if it is solid and things underneath look OK would the price be reasonable? It started out listed at $5,500 and the fellow who listed said 5 grand was the lowest the seller would go, but then they lowered the price to $4,750 - its been listed for 14 weeks now. I am thinking I'd take cash and maybe try $4 grand or try to include the other flat fender parts with it.

I'd plan to eventually remove top and the roll bar, but they would be handy to have until the weather is better for doing work on it because I'd have to park it outside under a tarp for now.

EDIT: BTW, what should I look for underneath? Is there a good way to determine if the trans and transfer case are GPW or later? And for a practical driver would I want a later trans or transfer case? Where I live there are a number of bulldozed but not improved roads and it is a short drive on a paved road to Beaver lake where I have an old boathouse. I don't see it as a grocery getter or daily driver, but as a "just for fun around home" driver and maybe some car shows when it is presentable. I would want to keep it street legal with an antique plate.

Adam
G-Lieutenant General
G-Lieutenant General
Posts: 4526
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2003 6:03 pm
Location: Little Meadows PA

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by Adam » Thu Feb 02, 2023 1:50 am

you Can make out the tranny and correct park brake, 1942 Ford GPW frame and running gear, viewtopic.php?f=5&t=332803


here basic under body viewtopic.php?f=5&t=332486

chuck had one for sale no pics though viewtopic.php?f=5&t=327323&p=1905746#p1905746

go back through the posts and see what is listed,

look around for rust and rot holes in the frame, you will see if underside is correct or all rotted out. look at brake lines,, brake hoses,, wiring, exhaust system, oil pouring out, broken springs etc, on an old jeep, most of this stuff may be bad, but useable, or its way bad and needs replaced, anything look hacked up or bubba'd. take a good flashlight and a good mat to lay on. look under the distributor on engine for welds or cracks, water freezing will crack the block. is there antifreeze in it? or is rad empty, can you shift the tranny and t case, roll the jeep? clutch and brake pedals work,, 3 of the guages are wrong for a factory resto, rear of body bed has caardboard or something on it.look in the tool boxes, are the bottoms in there or rusted out, flip up the passenger seat and have a look at the floor, should be no metal laying on top of original floor,, take a magnet, most stuff is rotted out near bottom of body, you will b able to see it from underneath. i wonder how much they hacked off the back of the body to put that rear panel on, take a trailer and truck,, or u haul it.

roll bars bolted to the body are worthless and give a false sence of security in a bad crash,, body will buckle and weel wells will collaps,, especially on a 80 year old jeep

then the title issues, will seller go to tag place with you? i do not know what your state has

good luck have fun if you go back a second day,, take pics the first and post or send them to me, i will post them, it is easy, as long as their size is 300k or so,

ADam

philwarner
G-Private First Class
G-Private First Class
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2022 7:30 am
Location: Northwest Arkansas

Re: 43 GPW with replacement engine

Post by philwarner » Thu Feb 02, 2023 9:29 am

Thanks, Adam,

Excellent check list that I will print and take along. If this week end materializes weather wise it will be very helpful. I am a retired engineer and my buddy is a working Professional engineer so together we should be able to scope it out.

My goal had been to find a 42, same age as I am, but at this point a 43 might be close enough.

I missed by one day a restored 42 MB in 2008 that sold for $6.500 and was being shipped to England. It was an odd color green, but everything was done and it had proper seats, Pioneer tools, a canvass top, Spare carrier, and Jerry can carrier. It did have radio in the dash and a 2" receiver under the pintle hook, but I thought the receiver was a plus. The only thing missing was that it had 1 piece steel wheels in lieu of combat wheels. I still have the photos that I kept to remind myself to search Craig's List for "Old army Jeep", as it was listed, in addition to military jeep, Willys MB, and Ford GPW.


Post Reply

Return to “Willys MB & Ford GPW, For Sale Section”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 45 guests