Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

1941 - 1945, MB, GPW Technical questions and discussions, regarding anything related to the WWII jeep.
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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by 70th Division » Thu Jan 19, 2023 5:22 pm

Hello,

That Euro based GPW block, if you look at the examples closely, clearly the letters and impressions from the casting are from a totally different
casting, likely a casting mold was made in Europe after WW2.

People have no idea how bad the economy in Europe was after the War, and the USA made every effort to rebuild economic activity ASAP !

Food was scarce, raw materials were scare, and most of Europe was left in utter ruin.

Starvation by the masses was an everyday threat, that US and Allied planners took very seriously.

Add bitter winter weather, idle and blown to bits, former factories, bridges, roads, and every major and minor city destroyed !

The real threat of communism was around every turn, and we had to get the people producing and working again.
Millions of people were at risk, everywhere !

A parts contract given to any company able to tool up and produce parts, for the biggest, and only paying customer available, the US Army would have been expedited by all parties involved.
It meant jobs, and money flowing to workers, including disabled German soldiers, that the US Army mandated to be hired on by German companies working for the US Army.

With so many mystery GPW engines being found in Europe, that would have been , by deduction, the origin of them.
Oz, I am thinking your brother's engine was made as part of that batch, like the double T castings found on a Euro engine.


Making spare blocks makes perfect sense as part of the jeep rebuilding program, as well as the rebuild European production program.
The Marshall Plan was the greatest recovery effort in history, and worked !
New blocks for rebuilding engines, since new blocks stopped in 1945, makes perfect sense.
Remember, Jeeps were not just going to US Forces in France and Germany, but to every single newly minted Nato country, to build a common defense, and rebuild their armies into an effective and equipped force.

Germans were building GMC CCKW beds, and new Ben Hur trailers as well.

Who made this pintle hook marked GPW listed on French ebay ??
Certainly not Ford during WW2.
gpw hook 2.jpg
gpw hook.jpg
As a matter of fact, even the British were making US Army equipment under contract for the American Troops,
I have a US marked canteen cover, stamped British Made 1944, that I have had since a kid.


It was done there, and no doubt on the mainland after the War ended, likely around the entire world !

Japan made replacement parts for US forces as well after WW2, as part of the rebuilding of Japan efforts !
Their cities were totally destroyed as well.


Best Regards,
Ray


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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by 17thAirborne » Thu Jan 19, 2023 6:06 pm

The engine is going in this GPW from 1942. It is strato blue over yellow over OD and was rebuilt by Allison in Phoenix in 1945. The engine going in this GPW actually came from a jeep repair shop in the desert in SE NM. The owner has been repairing all models of jeeps for several decades. I'm sorry I got the details of the origin of the engine wrong, but in any case it has been in the us for probably 40 years, who knows prior to that.

You can see my brother's progress on the frame and drive train. More to follow.
BLue GPW 1.jpg
Blue GPW 2.jpg
BLue GPW 3.jpg
Oz

Feb 43 GPW 98532 USA 20206257
Oct 70 Land Rover Series 2a 25334079G NZ16GF36
http://gpw.castraponere.com/ (My Restoration Page)

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by 70th Division » Thu Jan 19, 2023 6:17 pm

17thAirborne wrote:
Thu Jan 19, 2023 6:06 pm
The engine is going in this GPW from 1942. It is strato blue over yellow over OD and was rebuilt by Allison in Phoenix in 1945. The engine going in this GPW actually came from a jeep repair shop in the desert in SE NM. The owner has been repairing all models of jeeps for several decades. I'm sorry I got the details of the origin of the engine wrong, but in any case it has been in the us for probably 40 years, who knows prior to that.

You can see my brother's progress on the frame and drive train. More to follow.
BLue GPW 1.jpg
Blue GPW 2.jpg
BLue GPW 3.jpg
Hello Oz,

What a great discovery, a strata blue, USAF jeep !!
Must have been repainted after late 1947 when the Air Force left the US Army.

Is he restoring it as a USAF jeep ?
The frame is looking real good , keep us posted on the progress.

Regarding the double X engine, so it could have come from a Euro return jeep at one point.
Many Euro jeeps were returned to the USA, as I have 3, well 2 and a half, a Greek GPW body
that had a recoiless rifle mounted and had a notched down M38 windshield, and I know you have a Greek return :D
The Greek jeep was set up like the French jeeps, and US jeeps :D
http://www.m201.com/02743/M40.htm
The jeep was parted out by the owner, and I was able to get the body, but didn't take the windshield at the time.
greek jeep.jpg
But looked like this one when I saw it complete, except this Greek jeep only has the windshield for one,
the tail gate is cut out for the crew and ammo racks.

My brother has a jeep returned from Japan, with several Japanese made parts on it.


Best Regards,
Ray

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by ww2DAD » Fri Jan 20, 2023 7:14 pm

Just want to thank my brother 17thAirborne (Oz) for all the postings. I'm the owner of the "Frankenweenie" 42 Willys body/43 GPW frame and engine. I hadn't really wanted to start a project having given just about everything to my brother Oz when I moved several years ago. I knew he was into Ford GPWs, and about a year ago I was outside working on a 1969 V6 CJ5 I had. The neighbor saw what I was doing and told me he had a friend that had bought a WW2 jeep about 20 some years ago to restore. Unfortunately, his friend had a stroke after he bought it and had garaged it ever since. He said it was an Air Force jeep painted blue, so I assumed it was an old jeep from the post office. I went with him to look at it and sure enough it was painted blue but also marked USAF in yellow. Sort of short history- the owner bought it from a museum in T or C NM that was going out of business. The museum said it had come from the Phoenix area and had been used at the Phoenix airport and Williams Army Air Field. It had an Allison Steel Manufacturing Company/Phoenix AZ reconditioning plate dated 3/45 attached to the dashboard - not glove box. The tub is a Willys script tub. Since my brother and I thought it was a Willys jeep, and it would have cost an arm and leg to get it to where he lives, he passed on it. I felt bad for my friend's friend so I broke down and bought it instead. Turns out the jeep had a 1943 GPW frame and a large number of other GPW parts. The original engine had been replaced with a postwar CJ2 engine. I figured what the hell I would try rebuilding. At least it came with one combat rim. Well not far from where the owner lived was a shop that specialized in 66 -89 jeeps. The owner had a couple of WW2 jeeps lying out front. Sitting on one was the double "X" GPW engine serial number 107774. You can see where the original number had been ground off and the replacement number added. I bought the engine and am now in the process of rebuilding it to add to the frame. This jeep had 4 colors - early kahki green, late war od green, yellow and then the strato blue. I plan to return it to the Air Force strato blue in memory of my father a B-29 tail gunner during WW2/Korea.

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by JAB » Sat Jan 21, 2023 3:27 am

Wow! I hope you cut/paste that post and use it as the start of a build-thread!
-Jeff

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by 17thAirborne » Sat Jan 21, 2023 3:53 am

While Mike builds up his post count to post pics here are some shots of the hood numbers, the Allison tag, the frame number and the tub number. He is in contact with Tom regarding the numbers. There are two more renderings of the hood number below the strato blue.
mike 1.jpg
mike 2.jpg
mike 3.jpg
mike 4.jpg
mike 5.jpg
Oz

Feb 43 GPW 98532 USA 20206257
Oct 70 Land Rover Series 2a 25334079G NZ16GF36
http://gpw.castraponere.com/ (My Restoration Page)

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by 17thAirborne » Sat Jan 21, 2023 4:05 am

Here is a great link that explains the 5 digit serial number on Mike's tub. It is all seeming to make sense.

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=328735&p=1912096&hi ... s#p1912096
Oz

Feb 43 GPW 98532 USA 20206257
Oct 70 Land Rover Series 2a 25334079G NZ16GF36
http://gpw.castraponere.com/ (My Restoration Page)

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by ww2DAD » Sat Jan 21, 2023 8:59 am

JAB,
I have over 600 pictures of the rebuild so far. I picked up the jeep in March 2022. The original owner gave me a book of pictures from when he bought it and picked it up 20 some years ago. Once I get the beast done, I plan on trying to trace it's history back from when he bought it and when the museum that sold it to him acquired the jeep. I used to be part of the forum about 15 years ago but never posted anything at that time. I am hoping to give the pictures to my brother so he can continue to build the rebuild book he started. In the end the jeep will have markings on the front bumper from the first bomber group my dad was in. I may leave the back bumper kakhi green to put markings on it from the first Army unit I was in (early 80s Infantry in Germany). Only time will tell.

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by JAB » Sat Jan 21, 2023 10:35 am

Outstanding! I’m looking forward to following your progress!
-Jeff

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by ww2DAD » Sun Jan 22, 2023 6:24 pm

JAB,
Thanks for the encouragement. I will probably move the pictures and posts to the MB/GPW resto project page when I can. It will be stretched out over time. I did receive an email from a friend of my brothers who does GPW serial number data documentation and research. He asked that I send a picture of the casting date circle below the starter attachment point on the bell housing. I could read an 8 in the circle but not decipher the rest. He was able tell me the block had a casting date of April 8, 1943. That's pretty good because it fits in the general time frame of the chassis serial number.
Mike

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by 17thAirborne » Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:02 am

Mike sent an image of the date cast block on the engine and his assessment based on discussions with Tom W.
casting date.jpg
Oz

Feb 43 GPW 98532 USA 20206257
Oct 70 Land Rover Series 2a 25334079G NZ16GF36
http://gpw.castraponere.com/ (My Restoration Page)

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by nikola_n » Tue Jan 24, 2023 12:21 pm

Hi,
gpw 95526 assembly plant Dallas, Tx.
DoD 2-2-43 est.
hood number: USAF 20198139 correct for gpw 95526.
WILLYS FORD GPW WILLYS CJ3A
373792 82070 Louisville
374884 236903 Louisville
431988
443646

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by ww2DAD » Tue Jan 24, 2023 2:24 pm

Oz and Nikola,
Ozzie thanks for posting the pic, and Nicola thanks for the jeep information. It corresponds with what Tom W sent reference the Dallas Plant. Also thanks for the hood number info. This will be fun rebuilding. Today's labor of love - freeze plugs. Have them all in. Forgot how long ago I use to do those things. Paint the block next, and then assembly. I rebuilt all the aux items first (distrib, starter, gen etc) while waiting for the machine shop to finish. After this will be dropping the engine in the chassis. Trans and transfer case are done and have been sitting there waiting for engine. Will post pics when I am able.
Mike

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by ww2DAD » Mon Jan 30, 2023 3:48 pm

So I may have found some more of the history that might solve where the double "X" has been. Today I primed and painted the engine. When I painted the grey, 4 small rivet holes appeared on the driver's side of the engine near the rear. You couldn't see them before because the engine had a darkish almost black undercoating applied under the original grey paint. I found the original grey in spots underneath a yellow epoxy painted by a previous owner. The holes had looked like casting flaws in the dark background. Not until I painted the grey, did they stand out. My brother informed me that US Army 4th echelon rebuild facilities riveted a data plate on the left hand drivers side where you could see it. He has a copy of an original plate, and the hole dimensions match. Here are some pictures.
Attachments
c12.jpg
c13.jpg
c10.jpg
c11.jpg

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Re: Cast "X" on side of GPW Engine

Post by 70th Division » Mon Jan 30, 2023 3:57 pm

ww2DAD wrote:
Mon Jan 30, 2023 3:48 pm
So I may have found some more of the history that might solve where the double "X" has been. Today I primed and painted the engine. When I painted the grey, 4 small rivet holes appeared on the driver's side of the engine near the rear. You couldn't see them before because the engine had a darkish almost black undercoating applied under the original grey paint. I found the original grey in spots underneath a yellow epoxy painted by a previous owner. The holes had looked like casting flaws in the dark background. Not until I painted the grey, did they stand out. My brother informed me that US Army 4th echelon rebuild facilities riveted a data plate on the left hand drivers side where you could see it. He has a copy of an original plate, and the hole dimensions match. Here are some pictures.
Hello Mike,

That is interesting right there, another clue about it :D .
Has anyone talked with Tom W, about the double X, and double T blocks to see if he has heard of them before ?



Best Regards,
Ray


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