Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

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Kaiser Krazy
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Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by Kaiser Krazy » Sun Sep 18, 2022 9:36 am

For a reason that I won't get into at this time, I would like to take a Ben Hur frame that I have with Correct wheels, tires and lunette and skin the top of the frame with cargo decking and tow behind a GPW for a casket transport from a chapel to a cemetary a short distance on paved roads. I do not have a 1/4 ton frame, but do have this 1 ton Ben Hur frame available for this project.

Question is, the two vehicles involved are in two different locations and will not be connected until the burial service, so I'm trying to flesh out if this will work. So, the questions are:
With just the frame and wood decking, will the GPW handle the rolling weight? And, of course, with the casket.
Will the ride height of the Ben Hur frame be acceptable to the pintl hitch height on the GPW?

Has anyone done anything like this before either for such a purpose or for a parade or display? I presume the lunette eye will fit inside the GPW pintle hitch opening and it is just the ride height that I need to be concerned about.

Any advice appreciated.


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primal4x4
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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by primal4x4 » Sun Sep 18, 2022 2:22 pm

The measurements aren't prefect (I measured on uneven grass) but close. The Ben Hur lunette is 24 inches off the ground when on its landing wheel but the deck slopes forward. To get the deck level the lunette had to raise to about 30 inches for the ground. The jeep pintle is about 20 inches high. You may consider flipping the lunette casting like this picture.

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Kaiser Krazy
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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by Kaiser Krazy » Sun Sep 18, 2022 3:02 pm

Hmmm..so I could flip the casting and if it didn't have the landing leg attached, would give me some inches. Don't want the landing leg and wheel sticking upward, so I'd just leave it off. Something to check into.

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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by Rustman » Sun Sep 18, 2022 3:56 pm

It was done during the war!

https://g518parts.com/wp-content/galler ... ered-2.jpg

That's a water trailer behind a Jeep. Albeit, within a camp, not going down the road. But still, it is possible.

Matt
1970 Kaiser Jeep DJ-5A Left Hand Drive
1945 Corps of Engineers Welder & Trailer
1943 G518 "Ben Hur" Trailer Steel Body
194* G518 "Ben Hur" Trailer Composite Body
http://g518parts.com/

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W. Winget
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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by W. Winget » Sun Sep 18, 2022 5:14 pm

Towed a US M1A1 75mm Howitzer, it tended to push my GPW when braking, but I imagine you are not going fast and furious, so you should be fine with exception of slant of trailer.
You could possibly level the casket platform by placing some wood blocking in the front of the trailer, adjustable at the site and a few 6' long 2x4's laid down to the back without bracing as a platform possibly in ten minutes of work with a cordless drill and deck screws covered by an OD wool blanket.
Also letting some air out of the trailers tires might gain two inches in height reduction without damaging anything.
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Kaiser Krazy
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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by Kaiser Krazy » Mon Sep 19, 2022 2:11 pm

Waiting to hear back from CSM (R) who is assisting the family in this matter. If he OK"s the trailer concept, I'll get the Ben Hur frame over here with the GPW and see what we can do with the reversing the lunette casting. I also remember the Ben Hur lunette eye had a downward bend in it and I don't know if I can reverse that as well. I could frame up the board to level the deck and cover with canvas, or could even make some bar steel straps to hang the casting even lower on the drawbars if needed.
I'll post pics of work in progress if I get the approval.
TV coverage of the Queen procession with her casket this morning, showed the gun carriage set up that I am trying to replicate.

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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by Steve Webb » Mon Sep 19, 2022 2:45 pm

They have more practice and a larger budget for that stuff :wink:
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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by Kaiser Krazy » Tue Sep 20, 2022 5:09 pm

This is a Ben Hur frame that I rolled out of the woods this afternoon. Looks like it is a wood tub frame as it has not only the side channels that look like they will accept a 3/4" slab of ply, but have holes along each side channel for carriage bolts to run through the ply and hold it in place as well as two crossmembers that are drilled and I can run short screws up from the bottom and have a smooth surface on the face of this trailer.. Has hand brake that will probably not be needed for this event as the trailer will not have a landing wheel on it and will not be detached from the GPW. I'll leave the tail light brackets and tail light off it as well. No fenders, but I will have to mount some decent looking NDTs out of the tire pile. I'll pull a casting and lunette out of the parts bin and play with lunette and casting height tomorrow to match the GPW pintle height. CSM is getting casket measurements so that we can screw on stop and side rails to prevent movement of the casket during transit.

Decent starting point, I think.
wood frame 1.JPG
I pulled it out of the woods and up a slight incline by hand, so it should do OK behind a GPW, I would think. I will probably get the lunette figured out and test pull it behind a GPW before I start the cosmetics. I do have a 416 trailer that I could use, but this Ben Hur is a better larger size for the length of the casket.

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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by W. Winget » Wed Sep 21, 2022 4:03 pm

Just a thought, the 416's top rail height might actually work better for the escort detail, it's much higher up and easier to slide across the threshold to the front if a few boards were laid across the span and leveled up (and covered).
Reaching down for a casket will never be easy, nor present a neat appearance in movement.
IMHO.
V/R W Winget
Looking for 1918 Standard B 'Liberty' truck parts

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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by Rustman » Thu Sep 22, 2022 2:22 am

Curiously this was just done for Jim "Pee Wee" Martin. A friend alerted me to the fact that a Ben Hur was used.
Screen Shot 2022-09-22 at 6.15.47 AM.png
307449795_633727731455132_236705187721464006_n.jpg
305847236_633727658121806_695221448281616303_n.jpg
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Matt
1970 Kaiser Jeep DJ-5A Left Hand Drive
1945 Corps of Engineers Welder & Trailer
1943 G518 "Ben Hur" Trailer Steel Body
194* G518 "Ben Hur" Trailer Composite Body
http://g518parts.com/

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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by Kaiser Krazy » Thu Sep 22, 2022 6:11 am

Well, you had me rethinking with the 416 trailer with a wooden top for shoulder height transfer, but the family wants WWII and I don't have a era trailer yet. Picking up a Bantam T3C this weekend that would allow tailgate access, but I think the rear of the coffin will hang out and I don't want that look. The pics of the service in the Ben Hur look great, but setting the casket on the trailer floor is the same height as my conception, only no side on the trailer will make the casket and flag more visable and I just got off the phone with the CSM who is overseeing this service and we are all systems go for the wooden deck on the Ben Hur frame. It's all at Ft. Benning, GA and the Infantry Museum people are involved, so we need to be as period accurate as possible.
Headed off to Home Depot to look at wood decking options, I like the look of seperate deck boards, but a single sheet of ply is also appealing. May also explore the possibility of fenders on this rig, but only having the frame as attachment points with rounded fenders may make that difficult.

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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by Steve Webb » Thu Sep 22, 2022 10:56 am

The Bantam civvy is only 6' long so it would hang over. Your flat deck idea is very good and with the Flag it would be very somber on it.
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Re: Will Ben Hur frame tow behind a GPW?

Post by Rustman » Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:07 am

Kaiser Krazy wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 6:11 am

Headed off to Home Depot to look at wood decking options, I like the look of seperate deck boards, but a single sheet of ply is also appealing. May also explore the possibility of fenders on this rig, but only having the frame as attachment points with rounded fenders may make that difficult.
Send me an email and I will send you drawings, photographs etc of how the wood decking was shaped and put down, was well as how the fenders would be mounted.


Matt
1970 Kaiser Jeep DJ-5A Left Hand Drive
1945 Corps of Engineers Welder & Trailer
1943 G518 "Ben Hur" Trailer Steel Body
194* G518 "Ben Hur" Trailer Composite Body
http://g518parts.com/


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