K-38 trailers DATABASE

Quarter-ton trailer series, Wanted, USED PARTS FOR SALE NO EBAY or COMMERCIAL SALES., and Knowledge Base
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pierino
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K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by pierino » Sun Jan 20, 2013 2:26 am

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here is where you can post informations about your trailer!

I've added on this first page a sheet which I will keep updated with information given (like I did with Converto's on 1/2 ton forum).

feel free to post any information you have about yours: producer, Dod, s/n, USA number, owner, location... and a picture of actual conditions (unrestored, restored)! :wink:

I will start with mine:

HIGHWAY TRAILER Co., 5.12.1943, U-92696, USA number unknown, pierino, Italy.

Image


ciao!
maurizio
Last edited by pierino on Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
1941 Ford GP
1942 Ford GTB, matching #'s
1943 Huffman model 81
1943 R.I.A. Hand Cart M3A4
1943 Willys MB
1943 Highway Trailer K-38
1944 Ford GPW, matching #'s
1944 Cushman 39G
1944 Harley WLA
1944 Converto Dump 1/2 Ton
1944 VW TYP166 Schwimmwagen
1960 Willys MB-T
1943 Stinson L-5

Ronnie Guin
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by Ronnie Guin » Mon Jan 21, 2013 5:12 pm

Here is my FWD Auto Co. K38 DOD 10-19-43 Serial number A-36. It was found in a barn with the interior untouched and original silver paint. The outside had been repainted Air Force blue twice with yellow markings. There were no markings found on the original olive drab paint. There was a small signal corps emblem (shown in second picture below) above the data palte on the olive drab paint.

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Coming home before restoration
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Air Force markings on the rear
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After exterior restoration and new tires and tubes.
Image

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Ronnie Guin
44 MB-T-12/44, 1943 FWD K38
GPW 2956 3/10/42 MB 126655 3/11/42
GPW 113491 5/4/43 Slat Grill 112038 1/14/42
MVPA

Schultzd
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by Schultzd » Tue Jan 22, 2013 8:49 pm

Here is my Apr '43 Highway Trailer Co K-38 trailer. Before and after resto pics. I have no idea if the paint scheme is correct, but it is what I like. No serial or registration numbers were discovered.

Dan


Image
Image
Dan Schultz
Retired USA SFC
GP 9275
GPW 14944 M38 MC70324
M38A1 MD20035
M100 1/4 ton trailer 01177482
K-38 Lineman Trailer

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pierino
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by pierino » Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:56 am

thank you Ronnie, very nice restoration!

thanks, Dan... very nice too... how could you know it's an "Highway Trailers" and from apr. 43 if you don't have the s/n (thus, no dataplate I guess)??


ciao
maurizio
1941 Ford GP
1942 Ford GTB, matching #'s
1943 Huffman model 81
1943 R.I.A. Hand Cart M3A4
1943 Willys MB
1943 Highway Trailer K-38
1944 Ford GPW, matching #'s
1944 Cushman 39G
1944 Harley WLA
1944 Converto Dump 1/2 Ton
1944 VW TYP166 Schwimmwagen
1960 Willys MB-T
1943 Stinson L-5

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Gordon_M
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by Gordon_M » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:43 am

Morning all, a few things to add.

1. Can you add columns for "K-38" and "Model-S" please? Many of the survivors seem to have Model-S on the plate, and some will be non-military, but should be on the list for extra detail. I know that the military used Model S stamped units as well as K-38 stamped ones. I think the only hint I've ever seen to identify a non-military one would be those trailers that have the plate inside on one of the divider panels. Even if your divider panels are gone - if you don't have external rivet holes on the front lower body corner you probably have a non-military version of the Model S. Uncle Sam was fairly religious about having visible stamped serial numbers outside.

2. If you have a trailer with no plate, you might be able to date it by the springs. My springs have the 8 - 41 date stamped on the bottom surface right next to the axle clamps.

Image
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Here is the plate from mine;

Image

3. Robert ( Lt Horne ) does excellent reproductions of both the FWD and Highway plates
Last edited by Gordon_M on Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
Gordon

1939 TD20 Pickup
1940 WD21 Panel
1941 Highway Trailer K-38
1943 Ben Hur
1944 Iron Fireman T-36 Snow Tractor
1944 Saginaw M19 ski trailer x 2
1950 Saginaw M19 ski trailer x 2
1953 Tucker Sno-Cat
1986 Nolan Road/Rail trailer


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pierino
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by pierino » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:51 am

Hi Gordon,

thanks for your contribution... I noticed an "S" also on Ronnie's dataplate, just before the word "K-38"... but I don't think to exactly know what the "model S" is indeed... :shock:

cold you help me here? ...I'm still learning (and those topics I posted are a way to politely ask giving anyway a small contribution as welll ... 8) )...

yes, I will add anyway any detail that could help in knowing more about these trailers (even if I'm personally more focused on WWII items... 8) )

ciao
maurizio
1941 Ford GP
1942 Ford GTB, matching #'s
1943 Huffman model 81
1943 R.I.A. Hand Cart M3A4
1943 Willys MB
1943 Highway Trailer K-38
1944 Ford GPW, matching #'s
1944 Cushman 39G
1944 Harley WLA
1944 Converto Dump 1/2 Ton
1944 VW TYP166 Schwimmwagen
1960 Willys MB-T
1943 Stinson L-5

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Gordon_M
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by Gordon_M » Wed Jan 23, 2013 3:06 am

Morning M, I hope it is sunny with you - snowing here in Aberdeen... :D

I think we established previously that the Model S trailer style ( it was a Model S before it was a K-38 I think ) must have been drawn up by AT&T around 1938 or 1939 as the Parts List for the unique components start ATT-38-xxxx or something like that. FWD and Highway manufactured before / during WW2 - I'm sure someone on here had a really early one that was 1939 and slightly different visually - for example it didn't have the handle / lantern guard bracket on the lid

Come 1939 or 1940 Uncle Sam decided the Signal Corps should call it K-38, but there does seem to be wartime production with USA numbers and Model -S plates too. The Parts List PDF is dated 1944, and we know that the standard jeep trailer modified to do the same job was in existence by then, so it seems likely that both types were procured for a while - maybe the modified jeep trailers were sent overseas and the original type used in the US?

Eagle Manufacturing trailers seem to date Post WW2 towards Korea, and had slightly different wheels. There are three distinct types of wheel.

A. Disc wheel, two holes in rim in pressed recesses.
B. Disc wheel, one hole cut through rim with tube welded in.
C. "Spoked' version of the disc wheel found on late Eagle units.

Just to round off, around the time of the Korean war a different trailer appeared which had a full width body with no fenders and wider boxes, and a two-piece top.

Gordon
Last edited by Gordon_M on Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
Gordon

1939 TD20 Pickup
1940 WD21 Panel
1941 Highway Trailer K-38
1943 Ben Hur
1944 Iron Fireman T-36 Snow Tractor
1944 Saginaw M19 ski trailer x 2
1950 Saginaw M19 ski trailer x 2
1953 Tucker Sno-Cat
1986 Nolan Road/Rail trailer

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pierino
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by pierino » Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:13 am

thank you for the résumé...

I noticed on my 1945 ORD 9 (original...) FWD the many parts marked ATT (by the way, cage and holder were ATT parts too...) without indication about the year (like, for example, Ford was use to do...).

I will add for sure contribution to the list by those owning a pre/post war S/K-38... I went rapidly through the archive and found few posts about the argument... but I will wait for those owners to know about their wish to be in the list.

thank you!
maurizio
1941 Ford GP
1942 Ford GTB, matching #'s
1943 Huffman model 81
1943 R.I.A. Hand Cart M3A4
1943 Willys MB
1943 Highway Trailer K-38
1944 Ford GPW, matching #'s
1944 Cushman 39G
1944 Harley WLA
1944 Converto Dump 1/2 Ton
1944 VW TYP166 Schwimmwagen
1960 Willys MB-T
1943 Stinson L-5

Schultzd
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by Schultzd » Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:33 am

I was never able to confirm that my trailer was used by the military. Only ID I could find was the date stamp on the springs. Manufacturer was kind of a guess, but the folks here seemed to suspect that it was a Highway Trailer Co trailer. I suspect by what others have said is that my trailer never had a USA or serial number. It was OD green originally, but I think that color was commonly used outside the military during this time frame. The part numbers do match the books tho, so, and I think this has been said many times, these were civilian trailers that the military adapted in a hurry because of pending war drums, for use until the later Bantam style trailer was adapted for the same use. My thoughts.

Dan
Dan Schultz
Retired USA SFC
GP 9275
GPW 14944 M38 MC70324
M38A1 MD20035
M100 1/4 ton trailer 01177482
K-38 Lineman Trailer

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Gordon_M
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by Gordon_M » Wed Jan 23, 2013 7:01 am

Just to add some stuff.

I think Bell and other telephone companies used them in dark green - fade it for 60 years and you wouldn't tell it from OD.

If you have a look at the drawing number on the plate of my Model S, you'll see it starts 38xxxxxxx, and a I'm sure a pile of bits in the Parts List are coded AT&T 38xxxxxx too. SInce I've seen at least one trailer with a 1939 date on it, but nothing earlier, I postulated a 1938 AT&T design that had been given to others ( FWD, Highway ) to produce. Note that the '38' prefix appears on stuff that seems to precede the 'K-38' designation, so I suspect it relates to design year rather than the fact the same number appears on the Signal Corps designation.

Couple of thoughts about the Lantern Guard too.

Don't start to make them till you have a Dietz Little Wizard No 1 lantern to work with. I know you have an original guard, but in effect the Lantern Guard is a VERY tight fit round the lantern, so even measuring sizes from the original guard might give you reproductions that you can't get lantern in. The guard not only covers and protects the lantern it holds it top and sides too - very neat fit.

I made my guard with ordinary 1/2" mesh, but I have since obtained a well-used section of mesh from a Weasel exhaust cover which is exactly the same as that shown on the Parts List. I know the same mesh is available new in the US but it doesn't seem to be common elsewhere.

An image of Robert's reproduction plate. I think he can do them in brass or zinc for Highway Trailer or FWD;

Image
Gordon

1939 TD20 Pickup
1940 WD21 Panel
1941 Highway Trailer K-38
1943 Ben Hur
1944 Iron Fireman T-36 Snow Tractor
1944 Saginaw M19 ski trailer x 2
1950 Saginaw M19 ski trailer x 2
1953 Tucker Sno-Cat
1986 Nolan Road/Rail trailer

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pierino
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by pierino » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:46 am

Gordon_M wrote:Morning all, a few things to add.

1. Can you add columns for "K-38" and "Model-S" please? Many of the survivors seem to have Model-S on the plate, and some will be non-military, but should be on the list for extra detail.

I have already added the column om my copy of the database, and those will be visible in the next published issue... a soon as more owner will come and add their details

I know that the military used Model S stamped units as well as K-38 stamped ones.
until now I've no evidence about USA numbers assigned to any "model S" trailer... I should say that I really have positive detals about FWD K-38's only (714 trailers). thus, I can't exclude that.
I think the only hint I've ever seen to identify a non-military one would be those trailers that have the plate inside on one of the divider panels. Even if your divider panels are gone - if you don't have external rivet holes on the front lower body corner you probably have a non-military version of the Model S. Uncle Sam was fairly religious about having visible stamped serial numbers outside.
I should disagree here. on my trailer, dataplate is inside, HT K-38 may 1943, but I found a correct 10" white star on it. also, first OD layer on primer is a correct 319.
2. If you have a trailer with no plate, you might be able to date it by the springs. My springs have the 8 - 41 date stamped on the bottom surface right next to the axle clamps.
I will investigate. by the way, are you aware of any known difference between springs between FWD and HT trailers? number of leaves? number of clips??

ciao
maurizio
1941 Ford GP
1942 Ford GTB, matching #'s
1943 Huffman model 81
1943 R.I.A. Hand Cart M3A4
1943 Willys MB
1943 Highway Trailer K-38
1944 Ford GPW, matching #'s
1944 Cushman 39G
1944 Harley WLA
1944 Converto Dump 1/2 Ton
1944 VW TYP166 Schwimmwagen
1960 Willys MB-T
1943 Stinson L-5

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pierino
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by pierino » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:49 am

Schultzd wrote:..., but the folks here seemed to suspect that it was a Highway Trailer Co trailer.

which are known differences between the two?

It was OD green originally, but I think that color was commonly used outside the military during this time frame.
mhhmmm... don't think so. 319's OD was very particular...

ciao!
maurizio
1941 Ford GP
1942 Ford GTB, matching #'s
1943 Huffman model 81
1943 R.I.A. Hand Cart M3A4
1943 Willys MB
1943 Highway Trailer K-38
1944 Ford GPW, matching #'s
1944 Cushman 39G
1944 Harley WLA
1944 Converto Dump 1/2 Ton
1944 VW TYP166 Schwimmwagen
1960 Willys MB-T
1943 Stinson L-5

User avatar
pierino
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by pierino » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:55 am

Gordon_M wrote:...till you have a Dietz Little Wizard No 1 lantern to work with.

is the use of this particular type of lantern something that comes from facts?

thank you!

maurizio
1941 Ford GP
1942 Ford GTB, matching #'s
1943 Huffman model 81
1943 R.I.A. Hand Cart M3A4
1943 Willys MB
1943 Highway Trailer K-38
1944 Ford GPW, matching #'s
1944 Cushman 39G
1944 Harley WLA
1944 Converto Dump 1/2 Ton
1944 VW TYP166 Schwimmwagen
1960 Willys MB-T
1943 Stinson L-5

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Gordon_M
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by Gordon_M » Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:02 am

The Dietz was the most common lantern - in fact the one I have was NOS US Army surplus - I don't know of any other lantern that is a direct fit in that bracket?

Interested to hear there is a plate inside a trailer with K-38 on it, not seen one of those before.

Don't know of any spring differences.


Edited in later ......


Picture of the NOS Dietz Little Wizard No 1 lantern next to US Army packing;

Image

It had the NATO type stock code and was dated around 1990, bought from E-Bay Germany for around $30 equivalent. Although a Dietz product it was made in China, but I expect most of the used ones you could find in the US will be much older and US-produced.

Note the fit of the lantern in the bracket - has anyone found any other lantern that fits the bracket that well?
Gordon

1939 TD20 Pickup
1940 WD21 Panel
1941 Highway Trailer K-38
1943 Ben Hur
1944 Iron Fireman T-36 Snow Tractor
1944 Saginaw M19 ski trailer x 2
1950 Saginaw M19 ski trailer x 2
1953 Tucker Sno-Cat
1986 Nolan Road/Rail trailer

Schultzd
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Re: K-38 trailers DATABASE

Post by Schultzd » Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:41 am

pierino wrote:
Schultzd wrote:..., but the folks here seemed to suspect that it was a Highway Trailer Co trailer.

which are known differences between the two?

It was OD green originally, but I think that color was commonly used outside the military during this time frame.
mhhmmm... don't think so. 319's OD was very particular...

ciao!
maurizio

Maurizio;

I did not say my trailer was OD 319, I said it was OD. I believe even back then that OD green was used extensively in the US civilian world. All kinds of civilian things were OD, ie, tool boxes, vehicles, tractors, etc. I have no idea if my trailer was OD 319, after 70+ years, how can you be sure?

Dan
Last edited by Schultzd on Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
Dan Schultz
Retired USA SFC
GP 9275
GPW 14944 M38 MC70324
M38A1 MD20035
M100 1/4 ton trailer 01177482
K-38 Lineman Trailer

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