Getting ready to fight coronavirus

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raymond
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by raymond » Fri May 22, 2020 9:19 am

Interesting news from Australia.

Also explains why the Chinese Communists did not want to share the DNA profile of the virus.
A forthcoming Australian scientific study concludes that the coronavirus causing the global pandemic contains unique properties suggesting it was manipulated in a Chinese laboratory and was not the result of a natural occurrence.

Five scientists who conducted the study discovered an unusual ability of the SARS-CoV-2 virus, as the pathogen behind COVID-19 is called, to easily infect humans.

The scientists said there is no sign so far that the virus can be found in other animals, including bats or the exotic wildlife sold for fresh meat at a market in the Chinese city of Wuhan, where the virus was first identified and where China maintains a major laboratory studying such viruses.

The preliminary report of the study, which is now being peer-reviewed, is based on computer modeling of the virus’ ability to infect various animals, including humans. It was published May 13 on the Cornell University website arXiv.org, which is used for discussion of pre-publication papers.

Nikolai Petrovsky, the lead researcher, said his team suspects human manipulation in Wuhan because of the unmatched ability of the virus’ protruding spike to infect human cells.

The virus’ binding strength for human cells “far exceeds” similar properties for infecting other animals, he said in a statement on the forthcoming report.

“This, plus the fact that no corresponding virus has been found to exist in nature, leads to the possibility that COVID-19 is a human-created virus,” said Mr. Petrovsky, a professor at the College of Medicine and Public Health at Flinders University in Adelaide, Australia.

“It is therefore entirely plausible that the virus was created in the biosecurity facility in Wuhan by selection on cells expressing human ACE2, a laboratory that was known to be cultivating exotic bat coronaviruses at the time.”

ACE2 is the acronym for angiotensin-converting enzyme 2, which is on cell surfaces. The enzyme is the entry point the coronavirus uses to infect organisms and spread.

Human lung cells contain ACE2 receptors that have been shown to be key targets of the SARS-CoV-2.

A laboratory-treated coronavirus also could have escaped the facility through an accidental infection of a staff member who then visited the Wuhan wild animal market, Mr. Petrovsky said. Other potential sources include inappropriate disposal of medical waste at a Wuhan laboratory or transmission from a cat or other animal that came into contact with infected waste.
The forthcoming study, however, concludes that the binding energy of the virus’ “spike” protein — the crownlike protrusions surrounding the surface of the round microbe — is highest for humans and greater than all other species tested, including bats, which have been widely targeted as the likely original source.

“This indicates that SARS-CoV-2 is a highly adapted human pathogen,” the Australian report said.

The team analyzed spike protein binding of the virus on a range of other animals, including pangolins, civets, mice, hamsters, cats, dogs, snakes, horses, tigers and cows.

“Overall, the data indicates that SARS-CoV-2 is uniquely adapted to infect humans, raising important questions as to whether it arose in nature by a rare chance event or whether its origins might lie elsewhere,” the report said.

Jonathan J. Couey, a research assistant professor of neurobiology at the University of Pittsburgh, said he agrees with the Australian findings.

“Understanding the exact origin of this virus is vital to ensure that all scientific and medical data are interpreted correctly by policymakers and health care professionals alike,” Mr. Couey said.

However, he said, debate on the laboratory origin of the virus has been stymied by scientists opposed to even considering the possibility.

“Several scientists with obvious conflicts of interest have been permitted to go on the record denying that it would be possible to generate such a virus in a laboratory and stating specifically that the sequence of SARS-CoV-2 would never have been chosen by any ‘gene jockey,’” he said in an email.

“Both of these denials are not genuine scientific rebuttals, but rather semantic pseudo-denials formulated by some of those most closely tied to the funding of these [gain of function] research lines.”

“Gain-of-function research” is laboratory work to increase the ability of pathogens to cause disease. It is carried out to study pandemics and how to respond to them.
The Australian study is the second scientific paper to suggest laboratory manipulation played a part.

A group of Indian scientists published a paper on Jan. 31 that found the new coronavirus contained four insertions to the spike protein that are unique to SARS-CoV-2 and not found in other coronaviruses. The features, they said, are similar to those found in the virus known as HIV.

Those scientists concluded that similar structures are “unlikely to be fortuitous in nature.”

The Indian paper was withdrawn under pressure from China, but the scientists involved refused to repudiate their research and promised to publish their findings eventually.

Mr. Petrovsky, who is also research director for Vaxine Pty Ltd., a biotechnology company based in Bedford Park, South Australia, said the source of the virus remains a vitally important question.

“While COVID-19 has close similarities to SARS and other bat viruses, no natural virus matching to COVID-19 has been found in nature despite an intensive search to find its origins,” he said. “This raises the very legitimate question of whether the COVID-19 virus might be the result of human intervention.”

Like other scientists who studied the virus, the Australian team did not find easily recognizable artificial gene inserts that would signal virus engineering. Mr. Petrovsky said there are ways to manipulate viruses without such inserts.

For example, laboratory technicians could take a bat coronavirus that is not infectious to humans and force its evolution by culturing the virus with cells that have the human receptor.

That process was used to culture SARS coronaviruses in laboratories.


The result would be that “you can force the bat virus to adapt to infect human cells via mutations in its spike protein,” Mr. Petrovsky said.

Laboratory development of viruses also can create other random mutations.

“The result of these experiments is a virus that is highly virulent in humans but is sufficiently different that it no longer resembles the original bat virus,” he said.

Since those mutations would be acquired randomly in a laboratory, there would be no signature of bioengineering “but this is clearly a virus still created by human intervention.”

The Chinese government initially said the virus appeared to originate in the Huanan seafood market in Wuhan but later changed its official version to say the origin is something for scientists to study.

Beijing initially opposed international calls for an investigation into how the disease outbreak began but this week said it would support an independent WHO probe of the handling of the disease outbreak at an unspecified date.

Critics say Chinese secrecy has prevented scientists from learning about the virus.

However, “the nature of this event and its proximity to a high-risk biosecurity facility at the epicenter of the outbreak demands a full and independent international inquiry to ascertain whether a virus of this kind of COVID-19 was being cultured in the facility and might have been accidentally released,” Mr. Petrovsky said.

Raymond
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by tamnalan » Fri May 22, 2020 10:05 am

Raymond I thought you had an essential business to run?

You seem to have plenty of time to scour the web for obscure right-wing papers.

As an academic myself, I know that literature exists to support most any point of view, no matter how wacky that view may be. A smart researcher looks for consensus across the literature.

Most every person with relevant skills on Planet Earth — millions of them — from a wide variety of places and governments is currently focused on this virus.

Most of these researchers could care less about American politics.

You’ve found 2 draft papers that echo Mr Pompeo’s point of view. He’s facing potentially serious charges of abusing the taxpayer dollar.

Perhaps he’s trying to change the topic?
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by Old Dodge Guy » Fri May 22, 2020 11:29 am

Anything to deflect from the original topic. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Still crazy after all these years.
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by raymond » Fri May 22, 2020 12:01 pm

I don't work at the company anymore on a day to day basis. My brother mostly runs it now.

I do some business consulting.

Consensus means a majority of people believe something to be true or valid. If Science ran on consensus, the sun would revolve around the earth, there would be no germ theory of disease, etc. Physicians, even surgeons, needing to wash hands was against the consensus.

Science requires one to at least consider possibilities that go against the consensus.
Breakthroughs happen at the margin.
Without this, science does not advance.

The Chinese Communists' secrecy over the virus suggests deception.

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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by tamnalan » Fri May 22, 2020 12:43 pm

Science very much runs on consensus. Consensus supported through rigor. Certainly, every researcher I've known (including myself) would love to find that counterintuitive result... that undeniable result that overturns the status quo! That's how reputations are made.

It seldom happens. In the old days, ignorance and religious dogma resisted such change. Things are more objective now, thank goodness. Most radical ideas soon fade. The few that survive, do so because they stand up under rigorous examination by other, independent researchers. This notion of a human-created Chinese virus monster is not gaining traction. Perhaps it eventually will, but today it's still a wet dream pursued by the political fringe.

This unsubstantiated foaming from Pompeo over nefarious Chinese activity... how's that working out for midwest farmers trying to sell their soybeans? China was their biggest customer before Trump's trade war. Supposedly Trump and Xi negotiated a recent deal to restore that market. Perhaps some of your Clarksville customers are soybean farmers themselves.

Pompeo led the "Benghazi! Lock her up!" charge when he was in Congress. Millions of taxpayer dollars spent on investigations. What happened to all that foaming after Trump's election? The GOP held all the levers of federal government in 2017. Yet... nothing on Benghazi. No indictments, nothing. Whaat??

Just sayin' that Pompeo has a history of making big claims that don't stand up. Be careful about hitching your wagon to his!
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by Bill H. » Fri May 22, 2020 1:43 pm

Hey guys, let me know when you two are done. Some are growing tired of the Ray and Alan Show. :lol: :wink:

We don't wont to hurt anyone's feels! :roll:
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by raymond » Fri May 22, 2020 3:19 pm

I was trained in science. You were trained in math. Although math is the language of science, science demands a healthy skepticism of the status quo, i.e. consensus.

Even revolutionary thinkers such as Einstein got caught up in the status quo. He had a hard time coming to grips with the seemingly random nature of quantum theory. A theory he pioneered. He even scoffed at his own data saying "God does not throw dice with the universe". He was too caught up in the counterintuitiveness of it. Even though people like Neils Bohr and Werner Heisenberg had shown that randomness was a fundamental fact of the universe.

Raymond


P.S. China released this virus. China then lied about it, destroyed evidence, cleaned out the lab, disappeared scientists known to work at the lab, lied about it being transmissable,...............But if you want to blame Pompeo, go ahead.
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by raymond » Fri May 22, 2020 3:28 pm

Interesting data from Europe.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2020 ... recession/
For many European countries, stringency levels increased substantially after the World Health Organization declared a pandemic, even when their case loads were low

While not a gauge of whether the decisions taken were the right ones, nor of how strictly they were followed, the analysis gives a clear sense of each government’s strategy for containing the virus. Some — above all Italy and Spain — enforced prolonged and strict lockdowns after infections took off. Others — especially Sweden — preferred a much more relaxed approach. Portugal and Greece chose to close down while cases were relatively low. France and the U.K. took longer before deciding to impose the most restrictive measures.

But, as our next chart shows, there’s little correlation between the severity of a nation’s restrictions and whether it managed to curb excess fatalities — a measure that looks at the overall number of deaths compared with normal trends.

Deadly Outcomes
Deaths above normal ranges shows the European countries that struggled to contain their Covid-19 outbreaks

In Europe, roughly three groups of countries emerge in terms of fatalities. One group, including the U.K., the Netherlands and Spain, experienced extremely high excess mortality. Another, encompassing Sweden and Switzerland, suffered many more deaths than usual, but significantly less than the first group. Finally, there were countries where deaths remained within a normal range such as Greece and Germany.

Yet the data show that the relative strictness of a country’s containment measures had little bearing on its membership in any of the three groups above. While Germany had milder restrictions than Italy, it has been much more successful in containing the virus.

The overall impression is that while restrictions on movement were seen as a necessary tool to halt the spread of the virus, when and how they were wielded was more important than their severity. Early preparation, and plentiful health-care resources, were enough for several countries to avoid draconian lockdowns. Germany, with better testing and contact tracing and more intensive care units than its neighbors, could afford to keep the economy a bit more open. Greece, by acting quickly and surely, appears to have avoided the worst, so far.

The Economic Pain of Shutting Down
Early data show that countries with harsher responses to Covid-19 also suffered more economically

The economic data for the lockdown period are only just appearing, and they may be revised substantially in the future given the obvious difficulties of collecting data during a pandemic. Regardless, what the past few months suggest is that the economic cost is not the only downside to a draconian lockdown. The Covid-19 experience has taught us that it’s far better to respond quickly and smartly, with the right technology and mass testing and tracing, rather than only relying on the crudest of shutdowns. If there are second waves of the virus, we shouldn’t repeat the mistakes of the first.
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by Chuck Lutz » Fri May 22, 2020 6:42 pm

Bill....PLEASE close the door on this for the sake of the bandwidth being wasted. We haven't read a single thread about "GETTING READY..." in days. The COVID-19 is HERE so getting ready for it is a bit late at this point.
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by gerrykan » Fri May 22, 2020 7:26 pm

Chuck,
You may want to think about starting your own forum website, then you can have complete control over the content that is posted.
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by Ron D » Fri May 22, 2020 8:23 pm

Thanks Roy! Now that's humor!

I especially like the part about "for the sake of bandwidth being wasted". :lol: Right up there with plastic straws......too funny. :lol:
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by tamnalan » Sat May 23, 2020 6:36 am

Let’s honor the fallen this weekend by getting our jeeps out and displaying the flag.

Hopefully the virus will take a few days off.
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by raymond » Sat May 23, 2020 7:00 am

I'm "getting ready" by communicating information on the virus that you might not see elswhere and by explaining some of the scientific aspects. If that touches on politics, then it is because some of the decisions being made are by politicians. And many of those decisions were made with incomplete or inaccurate information and the decisions should be rescinded in light of new information.


https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news ... -lockdowns

Doctors in Northern California say they have seen more deaths from suicide than they’ve seen from the coronavirus during the pandemic.

“The numbers are unprecedented,” Dr. Michael deBoisblanc of John Muir Medical Center in Walnut Creek, California, told ABC 7 News about the increase of deaths by suicide, adding that he’s seen a “year’s worth of suicides” in the last four weeks alone.

DeBoisblanc said he believes it’s time for California officials to end the stay-at-home order and let people back out into their communities.

"Personally, I think it's time," he said. "I think, originally, this was put in place to flatten the curve and to make sure hospitals have the resources to take care of COVID patients. We have the current resources to do that, and our other community health is suffering."
Raymond
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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by raymond » Sat May 23, 2020 7:03 am

And here is a novel way to fight the Chinese Coronavirus :idea:

https://nypost.com/2020/05/21/scientist ... ronavirus/
Scientists believe cannabis could help prevent and treat coronavirus

They have high hopes for a coronavirus breakthrough.

A team of Canadian scientists believes it has found strong strains of cannabis that could help prevent or treat coronavirus infections, according to interviews and a study.

Researchers from the University of Lethbridge said a study in April showed at least 13 cannabis plants were high in CBD that appeared to affect the ACE2 pathways that the bug uses to access the body.

“We were totally stunned at first, and then we were really happy,” one of the researchers, Olga Kovalchuk, told CTV News.

The results, printed in online journal Preprints, indicated hemp extracts high in CBD may help block proteins that provide a “gateway” for COVID-19 to enter host cells.

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Re: Getting ready to fight coronavirus

Post by Bill H. » Sat May 23, 2020 7:45 am

Here is an interesting site to peruse. Note what states have the highest number of cases. :roll:

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

BTW, over 26,500 posts and this thread is eating up bandwidth? :lol: :lol: :lol:
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