MVPA Affiliate

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Mark Tombleson
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by Mark Tombleson » Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:57 am

I disagree Chuck!

You want to participate in the MVCC you should be a member... I was for years until I moved out of state. Cost $35/yr.

You want to participate in the MVPA you should be a member. Cost $50/yr.

There have been other affiliates over the years, like New York, for an example, that had the same issues and wanted some kind of special deal. I understand all their representatives pay yearly dues because you need to be a member to participate.

If you want to enjoy the benefits of being part of the MVPA as an organization then that is wonderful. If one or more of your VPs will not join the MVPA for whatever reason then i'm not sure what to say... other than i think the MVPA will welcome you back, when you pay your dues.
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John Neuenburg
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by John Neuenburg » Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:16 pm

I'm a little cornfused Mark. Also want to clarify some things.
Mark Tombleson wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:57 am
I disagree Chuck!
What do you disagree with him about?
Mark Tombleson wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:57 am
You want to participate in the MVCC you should be a member... I was for years until I moved out of state. Cost $35/yr.
Or $25 for an e-membership. What do you mean exactly? MVCC officers must be MVCC members for at least a year before running for office, as I remember the Bylaws. Only MVCC members can vote on things. Or are you talking about event participation? By the way we miss you!
Mark Tombleson wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:57 am
You want to participate in the MVPA you should be a member. Cost $50/yr.
Or $35 for their e-membership. Again, what are you are referring to here? Participating at a Convention? Being a Director or Officer?
Mark Tombleson wrote:
Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:57 am
There have been other affiliates over the years, like New York, for an example, that had the same issues and wanted some kind of special deal. I understand all their representatives pay yearly dues because you need to be a member to participate.

If you want to enjoy the benefits of being part of the MVPA as an organization then that is wonderful. If one or more of your VPs will not join the MVPA for whatever reason then i'm not sure what to say... other than i think the MVPA will welcome you back, when you pay your dues.
I talked to Dave yesterday and he is loaded down with stuff this weekend, so I will repeat and clarify what he said. He would like to see MVPA change their Policy #4 in the interest of reasonableness and to be more Affiliate-focused. He said he doesn't have a problem with the part about them requiring an Affiliate have at least three officers - President, Secretary/Treasurer, and an appointed Newsletter Editor OR Webmaster, AND they all have to be MVPA members. One can argue about the latter requirement but it seems reasonable. In our case it would be four because we have a Secretary and Treasurer. These are the key people who operate the club on a monthly basis. The problem is the MVPA policy is ALL officers have to be MVPA, and some of our officers do not choose to do that, and probably some future candidates too. If this keeps an otherwise awesome candidate from running for club office, that would be unfortunate. It's not like we have many candidates. I don't know how many other clubs have more than the minimum number of officers, but the MVCC has had regional VPs for decades. I was one three times. The number has grown to seven VPs.

Car clubs are inherently local, and this issue is about the club wanting to do what is right for the club first, then by the way for MV people in the West who attend our big meets, and lastly for the MVPA, not to diminish their good qualities.

If anybody wants to read MVPA Policies and Bylaws, they are on www.mvpa.org on the MVPA Info tab. They put many of their rules and procedures in Policies rather than in Bylaws which by rule are harder to change. Here is a link to the Policies:
http://www.mvpa.org/wp-content/uploads/ ... es2017.pdf
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Ed Roberts
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by Ed Roberts » Sat Dec 30, 2017 7:13 pm

I am beginning to wonder if this might just be a semantics problem. What if we members of the MVCC designated our "Officers" to be the Pres./Sec./Treas./N.L. Ed. That seems to satisfy MVPA rule 4. Our now Region Vice-Presidents could become Regional Presidential Advisors or some such thing? Our Regional representatives serve a huge and valuable purpose and should be retained and supported. They could still be elected as they currently are. I strongly doubt their motivations to serve are based on titles and generous pay. I don't have a copy of our by-laws so I can't speak to whether this would work or resolve this matter. I speak only for myself as a member of both organizations, and have zero problems with any individual exercising their own choices. Perhaps someone with more knowledge about MVCC by-laws can address my thought. Other ideas? Thanks to everyone who's weighed in on the subject. Makes our club stronger.
Best to all for a good new year.
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by John Neuenburg » Sun Dec 31, 2017 2:09 pm

Eddie, I was also thinking there could be a technical way a regional VP might not be included in the mandatory membership rule, but it looks like MVPA covers this pretty well. Here is the section in Policy 4, and some key things I underlined:

"Ten MVPA members in good standing are required for Affiliate recognition and to maintain Affiliate
status. Nomination, election, and installment of at least the following officers is required: President or
Chairman, Secretary, and Treasurer, or Secretary/Treasurer, and the appointment of a Newsletter Editor
or Webmaster. Other terms for these positions may be used as found within the group's bylaws. A
minimum of three officer/editor positions is required.

All Affiliate officers and newsletter editor or webmaster shall be required to be members of the MVPA.
Failure to do so may be cause for revocation of Affiliate status. This requirement extends to any subgroups
of Affiliates that have their own elected officers
. All Affiliate members should be strongly "encouraged to join the MVPA."


The "Other terms" sentence doesn't exactly pertain to the regional VPs, but it does indicate it doesn't matter what the Affiliate calls those officers. The "subgroups of Affiliates" statement was, according to Tom Wolboldt today, is written more for a club back east that has chapters under it where each elects officers. We have seven subgroups geographically with a VP for each, but each is not elected by his/her group, so they are not "their own elected officers." Each are elected by the entire membership. BUT the important word is probably "elected," combined with the fact that they all vote like any other class of officer, and they are people those members are encouraged to interact with. Our September 2014 Bylaws calls them Directors of our corporation.

I don't know how interesting these technicalities are to people but this is a good excuse for me to procrastinate on my weekend chores. Dave said there might be progress on this. We will see.
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by Ed Roberts » Sun Dec 31, 2017 3:01 pm

Good points, John. I shall now repair to the EM bar for a new year libation(s). Party hats for all my friends.
ER


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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by Ken Perkins » Sun Dec 31, 2017 3:33 pm

Why couldn't the club just pick up the MVPA membership cost for our MVCC elected officers as part of their service to the club ?
I think if it was brought to a vote it would put the issue to bed...and Yes John, were paying attention.
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by Chuck Lutz » Sun Dec 31, 2017 4:21 pm

Conversely, why doesn't the MVPA pick up the cost of the club/affiliates "officers"? Now for financial reasons alone I'm not suggesting that happen, but beyond the identification of "key officers" who the MVPA requires to be members, who cares how many "other" designated positions a club has anyway Like John said, we have a very vibrant membership in the MVCC and a good number of our members are in the MVPA. Should we deny membership in the MVCC if a potential new member does not wish to join the MVPA? Hell no!

Once they are introduced to local MV guys....the new guys usually join a local club/affiliate and the club and/or its members encourage the new guys to add an MVPA membership so pissing off the local club seems like biting the hand that feeds you.

Personally, I do not feel that my Regional VPs membership in the MVPA in any way effects their service to the MVCC in any way. I thank them for their service to our club just as I do the officers who DO belong to the MVPA.

No offence meant, but why the MVPA can't differentiate between "key club officers" membership requirements and leave the BUSINESS OF OUR CLUB to our club is the problem here!
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by John Neuenburg » Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:03 pm

Why an officer or anybody else does not want to join MVPA or anything else is up to them. I don't think it's mostly about the money. I think it makes sense for the club to pick up the cost for the MVPA and MVCC memberships for the three or four officers who do the most work to keep the club running: President, Secretary, Treasurer, and Newsletter Editor. Extending this to the others depends somewhat on the budget. If the MVPA mods Policy 4, maybe let the VPs choose to join MVPA or not, but the MVCC pays their MVCC membership? One benefit would be the guilt trip it lays on the VPs who don't do their job, namely write articles in the newsletter occasionally! All this is just my opinion as a marketing/PR committee person and ex-officer for quite a few years.

Dave has talked with MVPA and we'll see what happens. If they decide to modify their policy it probably takes a full Board vote. I don't know if they do email or phone meetings. If they have to wait for their next physical meeting but a poll indicates change is OK, maybe they could reverse their decision now and then vote when they can. The policy does leave the door open for this where it says, "Failure to do so MAY be cause for revocation of Affiliate status." It doesn't say SHALL.

This is a perfect time for the MVPA to extend some good will to the largest club in North America, one that has many more non-MVPA members than members. This is the club-joining time of year, January to December being the MVCC membership term. Members and prospective members are looking forward to getting info about upcoming events. The biggie is less than four months away! They are sitting down with their checkbooks as we speak and could easily write one to MVPA.

Unfortunately, MVPA's director Tom Wolboldt pointed out that the policy also applies to a New York Affiliate club that contains sub-clubs, basically chapters like how the MVPA was organized before it became an association - each with elected officers who are all MVPA as per rule. Somewhat different layout but maybe not enough different. So we are not unique.
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by John Neuenburg » Mon Jan 01, 2018 5:23 pm

I added a paragraph to my post above, and modded an earlier post, reflecting a conversation today with Tom Wolboldt.
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by chasendeer » Mon Jan 01, 2018 8:38 pm

How about we raise the dues $2.00 a year and pay all the officers MVPA dues??
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by John Neuenburg » Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:40 pm

chasendeer wrote:
Mon Jan 01, 2018 8:38 pm
How about we raise the dues $2.00 a year and pay all the officers MVPA dues??
Jay
Not counting our Life Members who don't pay dues any more, that would bring around $900 more per year. Too much for MVPA e-memberships. MVPA AND MVCC e-memberships for all 13 positions total $780. 13 positions is if we have a Quartermaster, which is an appointed but unfilled officer position, and if the Newsletter Editor job is not being performed by another officer, which it is now. Currently we have 11 officers, all who deserve a big THANK YOU for their service!

Would members support a dues increase for this purpose? Or maybe some other revenue could be found. Like a sponsor? Perhaps one of the parts vendors?
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by softskin_driver » Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:58 am

I want everyone to know I am reading your comments here.
I know I can speak for the whole board and say thanks for the vote of confidence and kind words.
I have not heard anything from the MVPA yet.
The Ball is really in there court.
I paid my MVPA dues for two years a week ago.
I did this as a gesture of good will to the MVPA.
I had been a MVPA member for over 25 years.
I have Supply Line and Army Motor issues in boxes from back when the MVPA was the MVCC and in California. Our club was the CCMVCC or Central California Military Vehicle Collectors Club.
For me I dropped out of the MVPA because of personal reasons not because of the cost.
The board and I want to keep the cost of MVCC dues affordable and raising the dues at this point is not nessacery.
But you can always help the club out by buying some club merchandise. We use that money for entertainment and other things at MVCC events so it come back to the members. 🙂
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http://www.mvccnews.net
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Re: MVPA Affiliate

Post by Chuck Lutz » Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:43 am

Personally I would support the club paying for "key members" MVPA membership dues, those being the four we have been discussing. However, I would not support the club paying the dues for every other Regional VP or any other "club official". On the contrary, I still believe that the MVPA should REQUIRE the membership by the "key members", but waive the requirement in lieu of a "suggestion" that all club officers join.

This should not be foisted on the members to pay for the additional officers in our club, this should be settled by the MVPA and to me, that would be a CLEAR definition of exactly WHAT officers MUST be members in the MVPA and then any additional "staff" the large clubs deem necessary to running their club be left out of that "requirement".

If the MVPA is reading this....change this section so it clearly defines exactly who MUST be members and leave it at that!
Chuck Lutz

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