Reproduction Bodies

1941 - 1945, MB, GPW Technical questions and discussions, regarding anything related to the WWII jeep.
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dpcd67
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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by dpcd67 » Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:22 am

The key here is to actually have the thousands and thousands of dollars needed o replace all those panels and floors; many guys don't have the money for that. (I have actually heard guys say that those guys should not even own a WW2 jeep)
All the jeeps I see now are all far less than 50 % jobs; more like using an original firewall. Maybe the dash.
At 50% I restore for sure. I have a 44 MB sitting here right now like that; after blasting, it will be a good firewall, dash, and maybe 25 percent of the rest. No floors, no tail, sides are all eaten away. Still thinking about which way to go this one; but if you have to pay a body shop to do the work, you are looking at a massive bill. Double or triple the $3k for a new body kit.
Each one is unique situation, both condition, and owner ability.
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Michael O.
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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Michael O. » Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:26 am

They key is to actually educate yourself on what and how much it will take to restore your potential candidate. If you don’t have the money and/or skills to do it right then go find a better one. It’s amazing that the guys in England will spend whatever it takes but we here in the US won’t? I hate having seen countless restorable tubs over the past several decades cut up and pieced our and/or scrapped in favor of a brand new repop tub because the owner didn’t have the skill or financial means to restore it. Remember, your jeep has only ONE original tub! I know all too well how much it costs and what it takes to properly save and restore an original tub. I’m not rich by any means but I have made several financial sacrifices over the years to be able to afford being in this hobby.
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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Michael O. » Fri Apr 20, 2018 11:00 am

Y’all should have seen what it looked like before....proving that most tubs can be saved. Here’s a photo of GPW 104111’s front floor and fuel tank well area shortly after being repaired.
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Mark Jesic
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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Mark Jesic » Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:05 pm

Looks a really neat job Mike.

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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Michael O. » Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:15 pm

Mark...looks much better now that’s it’s in OD 33070!
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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by fiveftsix » Fri Apr 20, 2018 6:45 pm

I should imagine it looks fantastic Michael,
I have nothing but admiration for your dedication and hard work plus of course the personal satisfaction of the end result.
Looks like you didn`t opt for a reproduction floor either but chose to fabricate it from a sheet of 18ga !!!
but not just the front floor the rear and riser too !!!
Outstanding.
I fully support your ideals IF there is a chance to save an original Tub.
You and several others may have a better choice of a restoration subject than those on the East Coast.
Where it`s not so much about a percentage of what remains of the Tub
It`s more a percentage of what remains of the Chassis !!!
As to someone finding a better candidate on this side of the coast will be rather a mission to say the least.
Chassis with U channel glued in, bits of angle V`ed to follow the curves etc is the norm and with that I`m not referring to the front horns, that`s another matter entirely !!!
The only remains of the Tub is the top half of the cowl and the remains of the dash complete with a radio cut out to right of center.
The rest is normally the non existent rear curves hidden behind a piece of chequer plate together with a tailgate, pieces of 1/4 plate as a rear floor and all manor of options to hide the road from the driver and passenger up front, as to having tools on the drivers side that`s a luxury...if there is an indent left.
Fuel tank is the proverbial plastic boat tank floating about in the rear !!!
My post was not to guide everyone to just junk a tub if it indeed is savable but more to the stigma of having to use one.
Jeep restorers/collectors have been very lucky with reproduction parts.
But restoring a Dodge WC sheet metal would be something else.
The Jeep is one of the last collectible vehicles out there that can and are restored by the majority
However that may not be for much longer !!!
But Hey guys lets not knock the guys using such a tub they are the newbies coming into the hobby, I myself have had to use one too
At least there preserving what does remain
Prices are rising and supply of parts are drying up very quickly.
Of course anyone with some knowledge can tell a repo tub from an original one
with the advent of JMP panels it will become harder to tell as will MD Juan ones too if they continue to improve there line.
Just remember guys it`s these very ones that are supporting our host here.
Without that support I very much doubt that a forum such as this would survive !!!!!!
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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Mark Jesic » Sat Apr 21, 2018 2:33 am

Come on Mike, put me out of my misery, im dying to see it in OD, i bet its a show winner, judging by your excellent standards. :D

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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Adam » Sun Apr 22, 2018 7:07 am

Frome somebodys old post "So, it seems there are at least 3/4 different repro tubs available. GENMARC,
BEMAK, ex FRENCH and CENTRAL"

This came for NH a few years back. Some say its Genmarc. Well how do you tell? This is for sale, hasfenders and windshield. 75% of repos cost.

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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Joe Gopan » Sun Apr 22, 2018 7:12 am

I was impressed with Genmark, they appeared the best of all the repros. Have saved a NOS Genmark Passenger Fender for a spare. French(W.O.F.) is not a repro, it is French Military Issue.
I can't describe Genmark except they came painted OD and stood out when compared to the others. Genmark has been unavailable since mid 80's.
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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Michael O. » Sun Apr 22, 2018 4:22 pm

I think Genmark tubs had a unique number on the driver side for board gussett? I know the MD Juan tubs do. Obviously, one can tell the difference from an original WWII production tub, a WOF tub and am MD Juan Tub. I can't think of the identifiers of a Genmark tub (besides their tub numbers and distinctive insignia on some of the panels, but I know they were of superb quality. I dont think the side curtain fastener joles were drilled out on them....like on MD Juan tubs. I remember seeing them advertised in Supply Line as late as the mid 1990's.
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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Joe Gopan » Mon Apr 23, 2018 4:30 am

One of the GENMARK principals was a gentleman named Ted, he showed up at conventions in his US Army Class A officers uniform at times. I believe he was responsible for USA market. He passed away and the Genmarks seemed to go out of business. I believe that two ladies from Belgium had something to do with Genmark.-Gone but not forgotten.
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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Al Rains » Thu Apr 26, 2018 3:47 pm

Michael, with all due respect, many of us do not have the thousands and thousands of dollars to throw at a 100% correct restoration. I, too, like to keep everything as original as possible and use NOS parts when obtainable and affordable. The majority, I would suspect are at the mercy of body shops to do the needed repairs and they, (the shops) will fit us in whenever time permits before the Big Money insurance jobs which can be many years in the making. I know, because I've had to deal with this in the past. Small town America is where I live. I've gone and brought home classic C1 and C2 Corvettes and a 1925 Model T Ford before because of unkept promises from body shops around eastern N C. Matter of fact, I reclaimed the chassis for my 44 GPW from one in Dec of 17 that had the chassis since late August. Took it to another shop and had to wait from Dec 21 until Feb mid month to get it back sandblasted with the front frames replaced and in primer. Should the hobby be for everyone who desires a nice looking WW 2 jeep with as near original as they can afford or only for those with the money and resources to restore to 90-95% original with NOS parts, etc. Sure a jeep can be restored for the $35-50,000 to achieve awards that the owner can be proud of, but I guarantee you that the owner of the jeep with a repo tub that he did the work on that was within his budget and time constraints will be just as proud of what he accomplished when he is driving his around or showing it in local cars, etc. Again, no disrespect to you in any way Michael is intended, but as in the Corvette world that I mainly live in, the NCRS has begun to realize that not everyone wants or has the resources to have the 95-100% correct as left the factory restoration and now have classes in their shows for them to participate in. I will be using a repo tub in one of the 2 GPW restorations that I am currently working on and will probably try to repair the other if I can find a dependable shop or welding/machine shop to do the body panels. Even thought about taking night classes at the local community college to learn welding or let the college use it for a project. The tub from the other jeep will be put in storage for a future owner or future jeep. Just my opinions and 2cs worth.
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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Dawgman » Tue Jan 22, 2019 12:47 am

Yes Al I agree with you and Mike both on many points. Save an original tub, by all means necessary if you can afford it.
But...
I for one am sick of being at the mercy of ANY body shops I’ve dealt with, bunch of liars,cheats, and downright crooks. I’ve had guys sit on my projects and keep asking for more money as they promise and do nothing. I’ve had my Bodies get caught up in divorces between the body guy and wife, and wife won, took the stuff to scrap yard. And I am not the only one this happened to. I’ve had to take one project to 3 different shops to finish. You guys think you’ve seen a thing or two. I can’t type all the BS I’ve experienced depending on others to finish my project. And if they do insurance work no one will touch a restoration around here. I saw one body man charge multiple tens of thousands of dollars to restore a project import car, not mine, in my area. Owner sued I heard. I was told the final cost was @ 90k, just what I was told. Yes it’s ugly out there. I have been preyed upon and find it very hard to trust anyone in the body shop business. I’m not trying to bash down guys as a group, just my experience in my area.
So... after that depressing rant...
I’ve gotten to the point that if I can’t do it myself, I will not have it done. And I have zero body experience, but I am learning...
I’ve seriously considered sandblasting a tub, pop riveting panels in, and going with that I am so disgusted with the promises of other people...hows that for a twist on saving an original tub? I’ve even entertained the notion of sanding and painting a tub with rotted floors intact. I wouldn’t actually do that but that’s where my thoughts have led me.
I haven’t even touched on the fact that you have to find someone that actually does know what they are doing, not just says so, and won’t smear the tub up with fiberglass.
Yeah, I’ve had it with body work...
12-12-41 slat MB
Midland/Willys frame script GPW 9xxx
No’s match 4-42 script GPW
No’s match 10-44 GPW
Dead MB plow
45 MB 8-21-45 restored
1943 M3a1 WSC
MVPA 7xxx

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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by dpcd67 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:13 am

Here is my advice to anyone in the front, or middle of a restoration. Forget commercial body shops, they are not trained, nor inclined, to restore historic vehicles, and if they attempt it, it will result in one of two things; default on the contract and possible loss of your parts, or, a bill to you for 15 thousand dollars or more. Or both.
So, Step one; find a sandblaster as close to you as possible.
Buy a MIG welder and learn to use it; that will take 5-10 minutes; any child can MIG weld. And an angle grinder.
Do it all yourself. Floors and every body panel are being made, new (or you can make them yourself; they are still not original; doesn't matter anyway) That is the only viable way unless you are very wealthy and just want to pay the money.
I consider body work as therapy; yes it can be frustrating as it is not precise like engine work.
As far as repro, and that includes floors and panels you make yourself, they are still not original no matter who made them. That doesn't matter; it is a hobby; we aren't restoring the pyramids. No one will care in 100 years.
All the super matching condition jeeps and bodies that these old guys found in the 60s and 70s, that only needed paint, are GONE. (Ok, there is one left in California but not east of there)
And yes, (heresy) use a complete new tub if you want or need to. Nothing wrong with that either.
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Re: Reproduction Bodies

Post by Joe Gopan » Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:31 am

I still have a NOS "GEN MARK" Hood and A NOS "WOF" Hood. Neither quite match OEM.
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