Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

1941 - 1945, MB, GPW Technical questions and discussions, regarding anything related to the WWII jeep.
Post Reply
User avatar
That Jeep Guy
G-Private
G-Private
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 1:12 pm
Location: Christchurch, New Zealand
Contact:

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by That Jeep Guy » Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:56 pm

Hi Hinrik,

This thread is very informative indeed! Great job!
I am wondering if anyone has found a suitable substitute for the BOM rivets?
The cost of acquiring the tool to do the job and fitting a handful of BOMs here in NZ is getting close to needing a second mortgage :shock:
Has anyone here successfully used Jo Bolt or Visu-Lok products?

Cheers

Guy

User avatar
Viking27
G-Brigadier General
G-Brigadier General
Posts: 2000
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2003 11:39 pm
Location: Iceland

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by Viking27 » Fri Aug 22, 2014 2:02 am

Guy,

Not sure if the Jo bolt or visu lock are strong enough. Remember that the BOM rivets are used to secure the spring bracket to
frame, so you do not want that to fail when driving. My recommendation is you try to team up with guys in NZ and Aussie,
who need to do similar repairs and spread the cost of the tools.

Reg

Hinrik
Hinrik Steinsson
White M2A1 Halftrack
41 MB 103469 107069
42 GPW 51368
Dodge WC-16/26/51
M38A1 USMC MRC35
WD Motorbikes

User avatar
That Jeep Guy
G-Private
G-Private
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 1:12 pm
Location: Christchurch, New Zealand
Contact:

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by That Jeep Guy » Mon Sep 29, 2014 5:19 pm

Thanks Hinrik,

I would like to go Huck BOM if I can find the heads. I now have access to a Huck 246 tool.
Is there anyone out there on the G in Australasia who can help me locate a 5/16 head 99-769 and a 3/8 head 99-1272 nose assembly?
Any help would be much appreciated.

Cheers

Guy

User avatar
Old Pal
G-Second Lieutenant
G-Second Lieutenant
Posts: 539
Joined: Sun May 04, 2014 5:39 pm
Location: Kelseyville, CA, USA

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by Old Pal » Thu Oct 02, 2014 5:34 pm

I have my BOM Hucks ready to go. Does anybody know where to rent the tool and the attachments for 5/16" and 3/8" near Northern California?
1942 GPW Restoration Thread

NOW ONLY 1 - 3/8" x 1" NF "F" bolts

User avatar
Old Pal
G-Second Lieutenant
G-Second Lieutenant
Posts: 539
Joined: Sun May 04, 2014 5:39 pm
Location: Kelseyville, CA, USA

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by Old Pal » Fri Oct 03, 2014 10:10 pm

After contacting several companies ( many had the tool but not the correct nose assemblies), I found a company willing to rent and ship. Ok fastener in Illinois.

Thanks for all of the rivet posts. I'm learning a lot about the rivet process.
1942 GPW Restoration Thread

NOW ONLY 1 - 3/8" x 1" NF "F" bolts


User avatar
Old Pal
G-Second Lieutenant
G-Second Lieutenant
Posts: 539
Joined: Sun May 04, 2014 5:39 pm
Location: Kelseyville, CA, USA

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by Old Pal » Sat Oct 04, 2014 5:49 pm

Has anybody on the G in the US made a riveting press that they are willing to rent? There is a lot of fab work involved with this thing and am willing to do it, however, I thought I'd try borrowing one first. I attempted riveting with an air hammer and a bucking bar with poor results. My pitfalls were as follows:

1.) The rivets were difficult to buck and would not be completely set in the whole from the bucking side after they were hit with an air hammer. I attempted to increase my bucking bar weight and still hat problems at 40 lbs.

2,) The air hammer tip that was used (purchased from big flats rivets) gave me a much more rounded head than a stock GPW. I will have to make something on a lathe if needed.

3.) Even though the shank of the rivet only stuck through 1.5x the rivet diameter and I did my best to keep the air hammer straight, the shank on the forming side did not round out in the center of the hole. It attempted to bend over and do weird things. I'm not sure if the rivet was too hot or what.

As I understand it, to make a press I will need to:

1.) Make a C shaped brace that will fit a bottle jack, making sure that the brace fits within each frame area
2.) Make a power unit
3.) Secure the bottle jack to the C brace
4.) Connect the power unit to the C brace bottle jack
5.) Possible make a ram that will fit in small areas, assuming the bottle jack ram is too thick
6.) Create at least four different dies to press the rivets

Whew!!! This sounds like a lot of work fabricating. I hope someone can help a fellow G member out.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Of course I would pay for shipping both ways, any rental fee, and cover any damages (even though I would treat this as if it were an heirloom).
1942 GPW Restoration Thread

NOW ONLY 1 - 3/8" x 1" NF "F" bolts

User avatar
Old Pal
G-Second Lieutenant
G-Second Lieutenant
Posts: 539
Joined: Sun May 04, 2014 5:39 pm
Location: Kelseyville, CA, USA

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by Old Pal » Mon Oct 20, 2014 8:08 pm

I got some parts in to make a custom rivet press. I went with an Enerpac 10 ton cylinder and C-Clamp.
102_2306.jpg
102_2306.jpg (63.75 KiB) Viewed 2387 times
A 3/4" Craftsman wrench is shown to provide scale; this thing is huge.

I will have to modify this thing because the portion opposite the press that will hold the dies is much too large to fit into some of the tight spots on the GPW frame. Also, the hole where the dies would go is about 1" in diameter. I will have to clip some much of this portion off and weld up the hole,or weld something to it. I think if I do this, I will weaken the C-Clamp. The angle of the C-Clamp may not be steep enough to fit in some of the tighter places. The other problem that I run into is that the clamp is cast iron; difficult to weld and weaker than steel. Any ideas on this?
102_2308.jpg
102_2308.jpg (55.98 KiB) Viewed 2387 times
102_2309.jpg
102_2309.jpg (47.94 KiB) Viewed 2387 times
I may end up returning the C-Clamp and making a custom C-Clamp out of some 1 1/2" steel plate that I have. The main issues that I would have if I went that route would be 1.) finding a way to affix the 10 ton cylinder and 2.) aligning the cylinder perfectly with where the dies would attach.

Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.
1942 GPW Restoration Thread

NOW ONLY 1 - 3/8" x 1" NF "F" bolts

User avatar
Viking27
G-Brigadier General
G-Brigadier General
Posts: 2000
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2003 11:39 pm
Location: Iceland

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by Viking27 » Tue Oct 21, 2014 1:41 pm

Old Pal,

Thanks for sharing these photos. For us it was cheaper to make our own clamp then to
buy and import one similar to the one you have.

Keep us posted on what you end up doing.

Reg

Hinrik
Hinrik Steinsson
White M2A1 Halftrack
41 MB 103469 107069
42 GPW 51368
Dodge WC-16/26/51
M38A1 USMC MRC35
WD Motorbikes

User avatar
Old Pal
G-Second Lieutenant
G-Second Lieutenant
Posts: 539
Joined: Sun May 04, 2014 5:39 pm
Location: Kelseyville, CA, USA

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by Old Pal » Tue Oct 21, 2014 1:49 pm

Viking27 wrote:Old Pal,


Keep us posted on what you end up doing.
I'm concerned about the size. The mouth of the clamp is 9" vs. your 4 or so inches. It also weighs 37 lbs. (close to 17 kg.). I think that I'm lean toward something that is a bit easier to maneuver.
1942 GPW Restoration Thread

NOW ONLY 1 - 3/8" x 1" NF "F" bolts

Niblet
G-Major General
G-Major General
Posts: 2661
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:51 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by Niblet » Mon May 04, 2015 7:13 am

I'm wondering if anyone has succesfully made and used there own tool from this thread?
alot of good ideas,,I would like to buy one if somone has one for sale,
or a nice set of dwg's I could bring to a machinist
1945 Willys MB
DOD 3-10-45
HN 20691353
SN 424804
My Restoration thread <a href=http://g503.com/forums/viewtopi ... >Here</a>

Pascal81
G-Corporal
G-Corporal
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:05 am

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by Pascal81 » Sun Jun 07, 2015 3:21 am

Hi There, great post which helped me a lot!

I do have one question, i cannot find out what size the rivets are for the MB, it seems to be different then the GPW?
Is it all 3/8?

And what type of rivet snap should i use, e.g. a AN470 universal head or a AN430 button head? :?

Maybe someone knows.. :wink:

pittsjock
G-Sergeant Major
G-Sergeant Major
Posts: 187
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2012 7:35 pm

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by pittsjock » Wed Jun 10, 2015 2:50 am

Pascal - they are 3/8th for the frame, although there are some smaller rivets in a couple of places including the grill mounting tabs.

As for the correct head, the AN470 is too flat. I purchased rivets from Big Flats Rivet Company in NY - not sure if they are AN 430 but they are much more rounded than the 470.

I installed them with a 9x rivet gun, heat and a rivet set from Big Flats. They came out pretty well, although the rivets are slightly more rounded than the originals. Bucking is the biggest challenge, but it can be done.

Other folks have also mentioned the difficulty of keeping the rivet straight. You do need to try and be as perpendicular as you can or you will drive the rivet off to one side. That being said, if you don't panic and stay with it, the rivet head will still form nicely, just a bit off center.

I did spring shackles all the way around, rear cross member and front gussets. Here are a couple of pictures of the rear cross member. Apologies for the not so great photography with my phone. The nub at the end of the rivet is from an imperfection in my rivet set - I polished it out pretty well, but left a little indent in the center.
Rivet1.jpg
Rivet1.jpg (238.85 KiB) Viewed 1998 times
Rivet2.jpg
Rivet2.jpg (241.38 KiB) Viewed 1998 times
Patrick
1943 Willys MB
1969 M274A2 Mule
Peoples Republic of New Jersey
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/PortrayalPress

Niblet
G-Major General
G-Major General
Posts: 2661
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:51 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by Niblet » Sat Aug 15, 2015 2:34 am

Pittsjock,
so you used a traditional rivet gun ? how did you squeeze the shackle rivets?
could you post a picture of the gun and rivet set you used please?
Thanks for the pics,,your work looks good to me!
1945 Willys MB
DOD 3-10-45
HN 20691353
SN 424804
My Restoration thread <a href=http://g503.com/forums/viewtopi ... >Here</a>

pittsjock
G-Sergeant Major
G-Sergeant Major
Posts: 187
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2012 7:35 pm

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by pittsjock » Sat Aug 15, 2015 2:30 pm

Niblet wrote:Pittsjock,
so you used a traditional rivet gun ? how did you squeeze the shackle rivets?
could you post a picture of the gun and rivet set you used please?
Niblet:

Here are the tools: 15x rivet gun purchased off of Ebay for a little less than $200, homemade bucking tool, rivet set for gun from Big Flats Rivet Co. (in rivet gun). I already owned an air compressor & oxy-acetylene torch.
Tools.jpg
Tools.jpg (226.35 KiB) Viewed 1855 times
The front shackle rivets are the hardest but they look worse than they are. The round threaded section of the shackle gets in the way a little bit and forces you to start the rivet on a slight angle rather than being completely perpendicular. This is a bit scary the first time. As long the rivet is being held firmly in place (more on the bucking tool in a bit), it will still form correctly, you just have to stay with it and use the shackle as a bit of a leverage point to "pull" the hot rivet into the correct position. When completely formed, the rivet set is on a very slight angle so it works just fine. The other key is having the right length of protruding rivet - you need a solid 5/8 with the rivet set I purchased to get a nice head. I ended up adding a bit of metal to the front shackle rivets because it helped to ensure that everything was nice and tight.
Shackle.jpg
Shackle.jpg (237.21 KiB) Viewed 1855 times
The bucking tool makes all the difference in the world. I tested a few other means of holding the rivet, but concluded that you want a solid chunk of steel and the ability to tighten/press it firmly into position. The top front gussets took me less than 10 minutes a side. The hardest part was not burning myself with all of the hot metal!
Gussets.jpg
Gussets.jpg (239.95 KiB) Viewed 1855 times
Patrick
1943 Willys MB
1969 M274A2 Mule
Peoples Republic of New Jersey
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/PortrayalPress

Niblet
G-Major General
G-Major General
Posts: 2661
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:51 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Ford GPW frame riveting instructions

Post by Niblet » Sat Aug 15, 2015 3:03 pm

I'm impressed! I want to do this myself,,did you Fab up that bucking tool? I could pay you to make me one,,I need one (the circled tool)
did you use a clamp to hold the bucking tool in place ? while riveting??
I like it! Thanks for taking the time to post the pics,,how did you fabricate the bucking tool?
1945 Willys MB
DOD 3-10-45
HN 20691353
SN 424804
My Restoration thread <a href=http://g503.com/forums/viewtopi ... >Here</a>

Post Reply

Return to “MB GPW Technical Knowledge Base”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: GI. and 10 guests