42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

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17thAirborne
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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by 17thAirborne » Tue Jul 26, 2016 9:15 am

yez216 wrote:1/2 x7/16


Image
Love that tag!!!
Oz

WLA SN 42WLA56511, USA-692406
WC-12 SN 8682327, USA W-231808

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by 17thAirborne » Tue Jul 26, 2016 9:30 am

This arrived yesterday. It was covered in surface rust along the entire handle. I used metal rescue, soaking over night. You can see where the hex wrench was above the fluid line as there are traces of rust visible. It did a great job removing the rust and preserving the parkerization. i will soak the other end tonight.

One more tool to go: 1/2 x 9/16 wrench!

NOT THE CORRECT TOOL. See 1stCav Reg comments and illustrations below.

PS: This may be from an earlier kit, perhaps stocks of them were on hand and some issued with later WLAs. Have received a few emails from folks regarding this tool. One indicates such a wrench came with en entire tool kit. It also appears to match the NOS tool kit offered by War Department.
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Last edited by 17thAirborne on Wed Aug 03, 2016 6:20 am, edited 2 times in total.
Oz

WLA SN 42WLA56511, USA-692406
WC-12 SN 8682327, USA W-231808

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by 42swing » Thu Jul 28, 2016 8:47 am

I've been searching, unsuccessfully, for the headnut socket wrench for several years now. Have a similar Ford wrench in the kit as a placeholder, but its just not the same. Anybody? Also the tire kit.
Malvern, PA
1942 MB 180635
1943 Willys MBT
1940 Elgin male bicycle
1940 Columbia female bicycle
1943 M3A4 Hand Cart
1943 Harley Davidson WLA with side car

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by 1stCAVREG » Fri Jul 29, 2016 5:42 pm

In regards to the screwdriver 11811-X and headbolt wrench 12047-30A, there are several versions of each.

On the screwdriver, the one that is shown earlier in this thread is not 11811-X due to length and ferrule. It is closer to 11811-45. 11811-X early versions have long ferrules holding the blade to the handle. Roughly 1940-1945, 11811-X has a medium length ferrule. 11811-45 has the shortest ferrule. If you look at the factory line drawings of the tool kit (there are two slightly different drawings), you will notice the different ferrules.
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On the headbolt wrench, the first wrench for 1930 & later SV models is 12047-X (see below) and appears in at least 1930-1934 accessory books. It is black painted with its handle attaching to the side of the socket. The handle is not knurled and has a bend. The wrench is not marked.

The second version wrench is 12047-30 and appears at least in the 1938-1940 accessory books. It is similar in shape to the first version except now the handle comes out of the socket from the top, makes a 90° bend and then a second lesser bend. Parkerized under black paint. The handle is not knurled. The wrench is not marked.

The third version is 12047-30A 1941 version. It is like the 12047-30 but has a deeper offset, does not have the mid handle bend, is cad plated, and has a knurled handle. The socket is marked “N 1894-1” over “12047-30-A”. It has a roughly 2-1/16” offset and is shown in the 1941 accessory book.

The fourth version is apparently the last version (not counting the below mystery wrench nor the double socket wrench 12047-30H used for all SV & OHV models) and is shown in post-war accessory books. It is similar to the third version but is Parkerized and has a roughly 1-1/16” offset. The socket is marked “42K-5020A”. While this number, 42K-5020A, is similar to Federal stock numbers, it is the H-D factory number for the wrench (H-D factory numbers are the internal numbers used for all items within the factory and were in use up into the late-1950s early-1960s. They are explained in Chapter One of Palmer’s 1937-1964 How To book).

Now we come to the mystery (at least for me at present) wrench, 12047-30B. I find it only in 1942-1944 military Big Twin SV parts books. Its illustration is the same one as used for later 42WLA models.

As far as fit is concerned, the 42K-5020A wrench fits WLAs better than the deeper 30A wrench. Both fit Big Twin SV models equally well (with iron or aluminum heads). In all cases, best used with the tanks off and in that situation you are best served with a deep six-point socket and torque wrench.
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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by 17thAirborne » Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:10 pm

1stCAVREG wrote:In regards to the screwdriver 11811-X and headbolt wrench 12047-30A, there are several versions of each.

On the screwdriver, the one that is shown earlier in this thread is not 11811-X due to length and ferrule. It is closer to 11811-45. 11811-X early versions have long ferrules holding the blade to the handle. Roughly 1940-1945, 11811-X has a medium length ferrule. 11811-45 has the shortest ferrule. If you look at the factory line drawings of the tool kit (there are two slightly different drawings), you will notice the different ferrules.
Thank you so much for posting some definitive information on the screw drivers. I have seen so many different variations on threads, and your details are a great help. I was hoping this level of info would emerge. I can see now in looking at the line drawings that the blade is relatively short. I went back over the last 5 years of g503 posts and saw a variety of different screw drivers depicted as suitable for the WLA kit. I also noticed the line drawing in the later SNL ORD 7-8-9 for the WLA shows a longer blade.
Oz

WLA SN 42WLA56511, USA-692406
WC-12 SN 8682327, USA W-231808


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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by 17thAirborne » Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:24 pm

From what I gather then,
The correct version for 1942 is the 12047-30A socket wrench with the shorter neck, with the knurled handle and it (MUST or SHOULD, not sure which is correct adverb) be numbered on the socket.
Oz

WLA SN 42WLA56511, USA-692406
WC-12 SN 8682327, USA W-231808

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by yez216 » Sat Jul 30, 2016 12:06 pm

What is this tool used for?

Image


According to some research, it was part of the earlier, smaller tool kit, not in the later, larger WLA tool kit.
'43 H-D WLA Type V
'43 Ford GPW
'43 Bantam T3
'43 30 Series Cushman
'85 M1009 CUCV

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by OLDABEWLA » Sat Jul 30, 2016 1:50 pm

Very interesting about the post war tools did not know that?

Makes me wonder??? I just picked up what looks like a mid to late WWII type canvas WLA tool roll pouch but the different is on the upper flap is taller also has no tie straps but it has a sewn on strap with the buckle.

Is this made for the 49WLA and on? On the WWII tool roll pouches the tools had a tendency to ware threw the canvas so could this be why there is a taller flap for extra padding ?

This new pouch find I was also thinking could it be for the uses for utensil? most of them type rolls are marked with a US and item numbers this one has no markings on it what so ever?

Could this be a new find for the post war tools will post pictures when I return home later.

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by 1stCAVREG » Sun Jul 31, 2016 10:08 am

17thAirborne wrote:From what I gather then,
The correct version for 1942 is the 12047-30A socket wrench with the shorter neck, with the knurled handle and it (MUST or SHOULD, not sure which is correct adverb) be numbered on the socket.
No idea if all were numbered.
yez216 wrote:What is this tool used for?

According to some research, it was part of the earlier, smaller tool kit, not in the later, larger WLA tool kit.
Wrench 11804-X is used for any 1/2" & 9/16" nut it can reach. The 7/16 hole converts the wrench to a handle for 1935-early-1940 version wheel socket wrench #11815-35. The early wheel socket wrench is straight without the "L" bend. With the introduction of the second version socket wrench and the chain tool handle #11817-40 the 7/16" hole became obsolete. However, the 11804-X tool remained in all kits except 11800-44 with the 7/16" hole being available as an assist wrench for the socket wrench.

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by yez216 » Sun Jul 31, 2016 2:35 pm

Thanks for the information.
Is there anyone who needs this tool for their kit?
I have 2 extra.



-Bill
'43 H-D WLA Type V
'43 Ford GPW
'43 Bantam T3
'43 30 Series Cushman
'85 M1009 CUCV

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by 17thAirborne » Tue Aug 02, 2016 6:46 pm

The person I purchased the socket wrench from indicated: " I own a 1940 Norton 16h and many years ago I purchased a large stock of NOS items from a guy in New-Brunswick, Canada, among the Norton parts were NOS Harley tools. He had purchased the lot at a Department of National Defense auction in Ontario Canada. All the Norton parts still in boxes are identified on the labels as coming from No.27 Supply Ordinance Depot in London Ontario."

Several of these wrenches were in the lot together. Are there other US WW2 tool kits that used a similar socket wrench that anyone knows about?

Here is the label from one of the parts boxes in the lot he is referring to. Just a little more information for the wrench puzzle.
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WC-12 SN 8682327, USA W-231808

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by 17thAirborne » Tue Aug 02, 2016 6:53 pm

In Palmer's book on the WLA, VOL 1 on p. 177 there is a pic of tool kit 11800-26. The socket wrench in the image is EXACTLY like the one I posted above. Does anyone have a clear image of that tool kit? If it is, this socket wrench belongs on the military 32-40 45ci model.
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WLA SN 42WLA56511, USA-692406
WC-12 SN 8682327, USA W-231808

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by 17thAirborne » Wed Aug 03, 2016 6:28 am

Another clue to the socket wrench discussion:

Here is the NOS kit offered by War Department.
IMG_9797.jpg
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Oz

WLA SN 42WLA56511, USA-692406
WC-12 SN 8682327, USA W-231808

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by matt506 » Wed Aug 03, 2016 8:33 pm

lCraig yes she's coming on up to Iola again. Seems to be a big hit and the only one so what the heck. When you bringing yours? hope to see it soon. ANY help on tools or spare parts i.e. tire repair kit is HUGELY welcomed.
SFC Matt Miller, "ALLONS"
4-42 GPW,
4-45 MB,
4-43 MBT,
4-43 WLA
"Find The Bastards and Pile On" 11th ACR 87-94

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Re: 42WLA Tool Kit No. 11800-44 Discussion

Post by 17thAirborne » Wed Aug 10, 2016 7:43 am

1stCAVREG wrote:In regards to the screwdriver 11811-X and headbolt wrench 12047-30A, there are several versions of each.
Since 1stCAVREG posted this, I have been watching the sales of "Harley vintage screwdrivers" and find nearly 100% of those listed as such are not even close. His post above has been yet another lesson in attention to detail. That is part of the reason I started this thread was to hear from and see the lessons learned of anyone who collects 42WLA tools. What a fascinating aspect of vintage MC study this is!
Oz

WLA SN 42WLA56511, USA-692406
WC-12 SN 8682327, USA W-231808

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